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In Reply to: RE: Tweeter difference problem with 3.3Rs and more posted by Satie on August 27, 2010 at 08:56:08:
Hi Satie,
Sorry for the delay in replying, - had to get a bit of afternoon emergency shut eye again!
So that’s great about the Wimas, - had no idea they were decent. I look forward to putting those in my PLLXO on Sunday, so I have all Wima caps in it.
Yes you are dead right about the 3rd order Butterworth, - at higher crossover freqnecuies, - by that I mean up to about 250 Hz, the sound is too heavy and not right, like this the mid/treble sounds shut in and not transparent, - and looses air etc. And when you put the freq down there is hole in the midbass liek you say and also the lower mid start to become a bit too absent.
Using second order Bessel at about 205-215 Hz and a higher volume level really does blend better to my ears, - the highs , transparency, sparkle and the midrange are all better. Maybe LR might be even better – I did not try it yet. Butterworth 2nd order was no good, too heavy again.
I still have to test out the parametric EQ properly on the 3rd order Butterworth, - I might be able to get it to blend a lot better using that, - there is potential there for sure.
I find it odd the 3rd order Butterworth does not sound right as this is the filter Magnepan recommend in all the manuals I’ve read with these type of 3 series (I read the MGIII, MGIIIa, and MG3.5 manuals). The 3.5 looks very similar to the 3.3 (the passive crossover design looks the same schematic, - just slighly different values used). And in the 3.5 manual it says to use 200Hz LP 3rd order and 200Hz HP 2nd order when using an active crossover, and the stock passive crososver freqs are quoted at 200Hz LP 3rd order and 300Hz HP 2nd order at the end of the manual. I am not sure if the 200Hz HP 2nd order is a typo, - it could be. In the MGIII and MGIIIa manual the active and passive crossover freqneucies the manual says are the same so it could be a typo in the 3.5 manual,
Anyway, I’ve asked Magnepan if they have the 3.3R manual or can let me know the settings it states, - just in case they are quite a bit different from what I am using. Perhaps if they don’t have it I can track down another owner that can tell me the settings the manual says so I can make doubly sure!
Will try out the L-pad using the wirewounds after I’ve got the right values!, eventually! Looking forward to that. I am going to aim for aournd 12dB for use with the Quad on the bass. and about 6dB for using the NAD on the bass, to eliminate any hiss.
Thanks again for that. Did not reaslise it was so easy to do an L-Pad.
The idea of building a 2nd order LP crossover with a level control sounds very cool, - will do more testing but I am sure it will work as the 2nd order already Bessel sounds good and I didn’t even try LR yet. That’s good I could use the higher gain Quad 606 on the bass with attenuation and the lower gain NAD going straight through to the mid/treble, and adjust the level on the bass only to get it to match.
The question is would the Butterworth 3rd order be better with a bit of tweaking with the EQ?, - not sure but I’ll see, - I understand 3rd order is not viable to build a PLLXO with ease though!
When you say I should figure out how I want my LP 2nd order PLXSO aligned do you mean Orthogonal and all that stuff?! How do I go about that and test with the Behringer what’s best, - is it the phase I have to adjust?
There is a high end audio parts store online here called hificollective,
http://www.hificollective.co.uk/
They are a bit pricey but I’ll see what they have with regards to pots etc. They do flashy resistors like Shinkos and Audio Note Tantulums, and they also do Black Gates etc.
A Technics SL1600MK2 is finishing on Ebay Germany pretty soon (one with a broken auto mechamism but is sound otherwise), - I am going to try to get it. There is also a SL17000MK2 which might go very cheap as the guy says it doesn't even spin (and the Auto doesn't work either!) Should I give the 1700 a miss if it doesn't even turn or do you reckon it could be easily fixable?(probably not I guess, - by me anyway!)
Goona get one of these for sure though, I want some dynamics from LP!, - thanks again for leading me to these decks!
All the best.
Colin
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Follow Ups
- RE: Tweeter difference problem with 3.3Rs and more - Davy 13:59:44 08/27/10 (3)
- RE: Tweeter difference problem with 3.3Rs and more - Satie 15:04:58 08/27/10 (2)
- RE: Tweeter difference problem with 3.3Rs and more - Davy 15:35:52 08/27/10 (1)
- RE: Tweeter difference problem with 3.3Rs and more - Satie 10:35:51 08/28/10 (0)
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