In Reply to: Correct. :-)) ... posted by andyr on August 9, 2010 at 22:41:54:
Hi Randy,
Its is very confusing I know and I have recently bought a pair of 3.3Rs from a shop where they had them wired up like this too for a demo, - thats how they thought you wried them up . In fact this was even worse as they didn't even have the external crossover boxes at all and didn't realise they were even needed, - they had one amp running directly into the bass panel inputs (so the bass panel was reproducing a full range signal!!) and the other into the internal crossover for the mid/treble, - both wrong of course! And of course the sound was appaling!I don't understand crossover lingo either!, - let me me try to explain it as I see it. Hopefully you will understand.
It confusing as you are right, the internal crossover does divide the mid/treble, but what were not getting is that the signal you were feeding into this internal crossover needs to initially be filtered of some low freqneucies (by a particular section in the external box) first before it reaches there. Its an obivious mistake to make. You were feeding the internal crossover a full range signal directly from the one the power amps instead and were missing out the first stage of the filtering process that cut off the low feqnecuies going into the the mid/tweeter terminal on the speaker, - this is not correct, and like Andy says its why the midrange fuse was blowing.Some Magnepan external crossover boxes (the wodden sides passive speaker level boxes) have two sets of inputs for biwiring/biamping, - your model does not unfortunately! This might seem like an unfortunate pain, and its true that yes you would have more flexibility to immediately passive biamp the speakers if you had an external crossover with two sets of inputs instead of one but you can get better results anyway I would have thought by mimiking what the external crossover box does for the mid/treble branch of the signal at line level instead of speaker level, - you can use a single capacitor at line level between preamp and the power amp (the power amp you are using for the mid/tweeter section) that will give you a bass cut signal BEFORE the signal actually reaches the power amp (not after the power amp as it usually does), - this bass cut signal from the power amp then does onto the internal crossover of the speaker and is correct as its a bass cut signal entering there. The advantage of doing the first stage of filtering needed for the mid/treble branch at line level is you can use a high quality and much cheaper/smaller voltage popypropylene capacitor for line level rather than the much bigger ones used in the wodden box at speaker level.
This is of course what the line level XO-1 (the black box) crossover does, - just some line level comopoenets inside that box, but you might as well do it yourself for much cheaper (if you can solder etc) , - you can also choose a capacitor tailor suited for your power amp's input impedance too.
So yeah Andy is right the reason the fuse was blowing is because the signal entering the internal crossover (the mid/treble terminals) was unfiltered of bass frequencies and contained too much current, - its a good job the fuse was there protecting the midrange panel. Send the internal crossover a signal filtered of bass freqneucies (either from an active crososver or a line level passive crossover as explained above) and there will not be a problem, - the fuse will not blow as there is less current in the signal.
Hope I have not confused you more. Let me know if you get it now. If not I'll try to explain again!
Cheers,
Colin
Edits: 08/10/10 08/10/10
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Follow Ups
- I'll have a go at explaining. - Davy 04:16:52 08/10/10 (64)
- RE: I'll have a go at explaining. - Davy 04:54:28 08/10/10 (63)
- Threshold is connected - rrob 05:51:22 08/10/10 (62)
- RE: Threshold is connected - Satie 19:33:10 08/10/10 (18)
- RE: Threshold is connected - rrob 20:07:46 08/10/10 (17)
- RE: Threshold is connected - Satie 14:19:08 08/11/10 (16)
- Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - rrob 18:55:25 08/11/10 (15)
- RE: Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - Satie 21:38:48 08/11/10 (14)
- Satie, thanks for the picture - rrob 07:02:30 08/14/10 (9)
- RE: Satie, thanks for the picture - Davy 07:35:50 08/14/10 (8)
- RE: Satie, thanks for the picture - rrob 09:52:26 08/14/10 (7)
- RE: Satie, thanks for the picture - Satie 13:17:11 08/14/10 (4)
- Satie, I don't think my preamp has - rrob 15:08:32 08/14/10 (3)
- RE: Satie, I don't think my preamp has - Satie 16:02:24 08/15/10 (2)
- RE: Satie, thanks for checking - rrob 16:33:04 08/15/10 (1)
- RE: Satie, thanks for checking - Davy 17:34:21 08/15/10 (0)
- RE: Satie, thanks for the picture - Davy 11:13:37 08/14/10 (0)
- RE: Satie, thanks for the picture - Davy 11:04:23 08/14/10 (0)
- RE: Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - pictureguy 09:44:10 08/12/10 (3)
- RE: Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - Satie 10:07:08 08/12/10 (2)
- RE: Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - pictureguy 11:47:02 08/12/10 (1)
- RE: Satie, I was planning to use the 250s - Satie 14:53:39 08/12/10 (0)
- RE: Threshold is connected - Davy 06:03:29 08/10/10 (42)
- No soldering of the capacitor - neolith 06:32:39 08/10/10 (41)
- RE: No soldering of the capacitor - Davy 06:52:49 08/10/10 (40)
- RE: No soldering of the capacitor - neolith 18:41:02 08/10/10 (4)
- RE: No soldering of the capacitor - Davy 18:59:11 08/10/10 (3)
- Single cap high pass passive line-level xo - neolith 13:19:22 08/12/10 (2)
- RE: Single cap high pass passive line-level xo - Davy 06:59:07 08/16/10 (0)
- RE: Single cap high pass passive line-level xo - Davy 13:28:27 08/12/10 (0)
- Do you need the capacitor when you go active? *nt* - MaggiesAndCats 07:22:55 08/10/10 (34)
- NO, But.... - Davy 07:43:05 08/10/10 (33)
- Interesting... - MaggiesAndCats 08:21:06 08/10/10 (32)
- RE: Interesting... - Davy 08:30:53 08/10/10 (31)
- RE: Interesting... - MaggiesAndCats 09:06:17 08/10/10 (30)
- RE: Interesting... - Davy 09:27:10 08/10/10 (29)
- RE: Interesting... - Davy 16:15:28 08/10/10 (28)
- Analog only - MaggiesAndCats 20:33:51 08/10/10 (25)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 03:52:58 08/11/10 (24)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Satie 14:49:11 08/11/10 (9)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Davy 16:09:13 08/11/10 (8)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Satie 23:04:46 08/11/10 (7)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Davy 06:33:18 08/12/10 (6)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Satie 09:55:03 08/12/10 (5)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Davy 13:09:23 08/12/10 (4)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Satie 12:59:29 08/14/10 (3)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Davy 14:35:18 08/14/10 (2)
- RE: DIGITAL only - Satie 16:30:17 08/15/10 (1)
- Thanks Satie, I'm getting there! - (slowly!) - Davy 17:43:28 08/15/10 (0)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 11:34:49 08/11/10 (13)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 12:12:21 08/11/10 (12)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 12:59:57 08/11/10 (11)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 13:33:51 08/11/10 (10)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 16:57:48 08/11/10 (9)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 17:57:01 08/11/10 (8)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 18:17:09 08/11/10 (7)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 19:11:56 08/11/10 (6)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 20:12:43 08/11/10 (5)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 06:27:52 08/12/10 (4)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 08:26:39 08/12/10 (3)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 12:57:39 08/12/10 (2)
- RE: Analog only - josh358 13:13:16 08/12/10 (1)
- RE: Analog only - Davy 13:19:29 08/12/10 (0)
- RE: Interesting... - rrob 17:26:58 08/10/10 (1)
- RE: Interesting... - Davy 17:39:44 08/10/10 (0)