In Reply to: Re: now we are getting to the bottom of this thread... posted by Soundmind on August 23, 2004 at 11:59:44:
Your test recommendation is an example of "looking where the light is better"; the test is attempting to look at audibility in a practical manner, but it is invasive.What do I mean by that?
1) You suggest listening to the cable in a different or artificial context, e.g in the tape loop. Unless the cable is to be applied in a tape loop, you've introduced a variable. Given that the interdependence of source, cable and load is almost certainly a factor in the resulting sound....
2) The act of listening in an attempt to identify differences is a fundamentally different task than listening to music, so you have introduced another variable. Has anyone proven that the results are the same? Are the same parts of the brain exercised?
AFAIK, there are no switching methodologies that have been shown to reliably detect small differences. Much of the debate around the value of ABX as a tool for cable analysis concerns the consistent null results -- which could mean that there are no differences, or that the test fails to find them. Let's face it, the sonic differences in cables tend to be very subtle (despite the claims of enthusiastic audiophiles) so we are going to have to be very careful about test methodologies.
You said:
"If there is no objective measure to determining the quality of a cable, then there is no rational way to select one."
What about the obvious method: which one sounds better? Why is that irrational? It is, after all the the only measure of cable quality. I'm not talking about compensating distortions; I'm talking about "better". Why is it necessary to have an objective measurement framework, other than to facilitate design?
Remember that this thread started from the publication of a link to a set of measurements. My post was to point out that we still don't have a correlation between measurements and sound quality.
Peter
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Follow Ups
- A couple of problems with that - Commuteman 15:16:04 08/23/04 (35)
- Re: A couple of problems with that - Soundmind 16:29:46 08/23/04 (34)
- Some misunderstandings - Commuteman 17:34:52 08/23/04 (33)
- Re: Some misunderstandings - jneutron 10:49:23 08/24/04 (2)
- Now we're gettin' somewhere! :-) - Commuteman 14:52:33 08/25/04 (1)
- Re: Now we're gettin' somewhere! :-) - jneutron 06:01:30 08/26/04 (0)
- Re: Some misunderstandings - Soundmind 19:20:30 08/23/04 (29)
- The Gloves are off! - Jon Risch 20:07:42 08/23/04 (28)
- Re: The Gloves are off! - jneutron 06:00:04 08/24/04 (20)
- C'mon John... - Commuteman 08:21:27 08/24/04 (19)
- Hi peter - jneutron 09:09:44 08/24/04 (18)
- But he hit the nail on te head..... - Commuteman 09:27:59 08/24/04 (17)
- What nail? - jneutron 10:15:25 08/24/04 (16)
- Re: What nail? - Jon Risch 19:41:38 08/24/04 (10)
- Re: What nail? - Mudcat 11:34:38 10/28/04 (1)
- Re: What nail? - Mudcat 11:36:52 10/28/04 (0)
- more denigration there Jon?? do any synchronized swimming lately? - jneutron 06:34:46 08/25/04 (7)
- There was some content in JR's post. Gonna answer, or continue to sling mud? nt - Commuteman 13:05:40 08/25/04 (6)
- Lets review the content...and see what there is to answer.. - jneutron 13:37:31 08/25/04 (5)
- Wow, John... - Commuteman 14:14:34 08/25/04 (4)
- Stop with the between the lines stuff. - jneutron 06:52:48 08/26/04 (3)
- Sorry - wont chicken out again on you ;o) nt! - Granholm 06:09:43 08/27/04 (2)
- Well ok.. - Granholm 06:19:54 08/27/04 (1)
- Re: Well ok.. - jneutron 06:49:29 08/27/04 (0)
- OK - Commuteman 10:56:37 08/24/04 (4)
- Re: OK - Dan Banquer 11:58:37 08/24/04 (1)
- Great post....see we can discuss reasonably...... - Commuteman 17:28:44 08/24/04 (0)
- Re: OK - jneutron 11:53:44 08/24/04 (1)
- Re: OK - Dan Banquer 12:37:45 08/24/04 (0)
- Re: The Gloves are off! - Soundmind 04:53:26 08/24/04 (6)
- One last attempt. - Jon Risch 20:38:34 08/24/04 (1)
- Incorrect again, dude... - jneutron 06:58:11 08/25/04 (0)
- Hmmmm... where have you been? - Commuteman 09:12:29 08/24/04 (3)
- Hmmm - jneutron 10:19:40 08/24/04 (1)
- Hey, everybody has moments of weakness....;-) - Commuteman 11:32:30 08/24/04 (0)
- Re: Hmmmm... where have you been? - Soundmind 09:20:33 08/24/04 (0)