Tweakers' Asylum

The modder disagrees with this from a logic standpoint, but

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hukkfinn

A

In Reply to: RE: The shunt element affects the audio signal more than the series element posted by Slider on February 09, 2010 at 08:38:08

... admits that he has not done any extensive research on resistor sound quality.

His point is that with a shunt to ground, the audio signal is NOT passing through the resistor. Therefore, it seems unlikely that the resistor will influence the sound that hits your eardrums.

I am very open to either answer, because while I understand the modder's logic, and it's compelling, I am also noticing the SAME annoying sound qualities in both preamps -- one of which has vishays in the path of the audio signal, the other of which has vishays as shunts to ground.

Follow Ups:

Agree with Slider. - Al Sekela 15:21:30 02/09/10 (5)
Your modifier is using faulty logic.

If he thinks the resistors to ground have no effect on the signal, then why did he replace the originals?
- so far the logic of the modder seems clearly correct to my pea brain - hukkfinn 22:07:08 02/09/10 (4)
  The modder did not say that shunt resistors have no effect on the sound. He feels that poor resistors in this position can contribute noise to the audio signal. Quality resistors in this position improve sonics by reducing noise, he says.
  
  I hear the argument that a shunt-to-ground resistor is like a bypass capacitor, which we all know *does* contribute to sonics. But doesn't the audio signal really, actually pass through a bypass cap? Whereas, the signal does not pass through a shunt to ground?
  
  Either way I know logic is not what matters, it's experience. And I am grateful to you all for your thoughts. I'm gonna put a Riken or a PRP in place of these vishays and report back to you. Thanks again,
  
  Hukk
  - The signal is the voltage, not the current. - Al Sekela 16:03:49 02/10/10 (0)
    The shunt resistor affects the voltage that appears across it. This is the "signal," and not just the current that passes through the series resistor or previous stage.
    
    This is where the logic is faulty. I just mentioned the contradiction of replacing unimportant components to highlight the fuzzy thinking.
  - RE: so far the logic of the modder seems clearly correct to my pea brain - rick_m 08:14:26 02/10/10 (2)
    "Either way I know logic is not what matters, it's experience."
    
    I think logic and understanding are more important than experience because they drive the experiences. If my experience was that my 'modder' didn't understand a two element network, I'd be moving right along. In the VW beetle days you knew you'd reached that point when the 'mechanic' asks you to pop the hood so he can check the oil. I think you've arrived.
    
    Rick
    - I meant experience like, "hey, that expensive power cord really does sound better... - hukkfinn 08:20:43 02/10/10 (1)
      ...even though there is no logical reason that a power cord should affect sound quality."
      
      You always see people ridiculing audiophile stuff like cables and power cords -- "it's just electrons!" "the power cord is just the last 3 feet of a chain of wire coming from the electric company!" "how could it make any difference?"
      
      But then you try one and you realize, with your experience, that it can actually matter.
      
      So I am not going to sit here with a strident phono pre just because I am devoted to some logical concept. I trust the experiences of others in the asylum.
      - I agree. - rick_m 09:24:12 02/10/10 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: I meant experience like, "hey, that expensive power cord really does sound better... posted by hukkfinn on February 10, 2010 at 08:20:43
        
        I'm all for that type of experience, have some myself. By the way I don't agree that "there is no logical reasons" for power cords to make a difference even though I have yet to actually experience it.
        
        What I was trying to say is that knowing whether a shunt resistor is in the 'signal path' or not (it is) is a matter of competence, while knowing WHAT part to use is largely a matter of experience.
        
        Rick
basic electronics - Slider 09:45:32 02/09/10 (0)
The audio signal flows through both, so the signal level (and hence signal "quality" from an audio standpoint) is a function of both.
The easy to visualize input to output "signal path" being all that affects sound quality is just one of many long standing audio myths. People used to dismiss the contribution of power supplies, and bypass capacitors, and circuit boards, and every other part of the circuit that wasn't directly connecting the dots from input to output. Fortunately not all designers believed that.

Edits: 02/10/10

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