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In Reply to: RE: My first purchase on Aliexpress posted by ABliss on September 11, 2022 at 08:19:38
If you are cool with that, you do you. People don't "like" to bash china, insomuch you could say people "like" to bash criminals.
Follow Ups:
the US prison system. Many large US corporations are the beneficiaries.
Open up your mind, in pours the trash. - Meat Puppets, 1987
Edits: 09/21/22
I think the Washington Post had an article on US Prisons and how prisoners are forced to work for an average wage on 0.58 cents per hour. Over 2 billion dollars of labor wages are produced each year....so much for CHINA bashing
When it comes to pointing just think four fingers are pointing back at the pointer. I recall when "Made in Japan" was laughable and a teh heh in cartons. The initial offerings of Toyota, Honda, and Datsun (Nissan) were questionable products when they first entered Western markets.
Who is laughing now.
The history of modern Western culture is based upon exploitation of materials, labor, and ideas. Once those who have been exploited rise up - then comes the clutching of the pearls. Most of the bellyaching comes because companies who voluntarily took products offshore because it was cheaper to use child/slave labor. The intellectual property was given to them to manufacture. They are just taking advantage of an opportunity.
If you don't like the progression of industrialization and capitalization - then spend your money as you so choose. Just recognize that Sony, Hitachi, Samsung, et all have pulled themselves up by their intellectually deprived bootstraps. The list of ideas, processes, and products that have been ripped off from the "colonies" is unfathomable.
Get a grip and keep your jingoistic opinions to yourself. In the case some product endangers someone - then certainly speak up, otherwise let others glow in the pride of their purchase. YMMV
DaveT
From near the beginning, Japan applied the prinicples of continuous process improvement to their products.
The works of Demming and maybe a few others were taken to heart and USED while here in the US those same guys couldn't get served at a lunch counter.....
Look down the article at the Ford-Mazda example and you tell ME.......
In the computer age? It is maybe easier to tap into someone elses research and result than DIY.
China Aggressively sends talent overseas to learn and work......and take this result BACK to China.
I knew MANY Chines in this situation. Some with 2nd string PHDs from US schools who had Children BACK in China.....(Hostages?) Others were extremely bright...and I mean top 1% in smarts and worked UP to high levels in corporations. ALL had a very good work ethic and some were even willing to SHARE knowledge. The 'Don't touch my rice bowl' philiosophy didn't apply to all.....
Taking advantage of an opportunity? Sure. Creating an opportunity thru criminal trespass is another matter entirely.
The Legacy of MAO lives on....at the cost of Millions of lives and much suffering.
One company I worked for? We SOLD CHINA a complete wafer fabrication facility. ALL the equipment which was allowed by US export restrictions.....(fewer and fewer) while I PERSONALLY CAUGHT a few of 'em IN THE FAB with a CAMERA taking photos of the specification book, which was NOT part of the deal and was company proprietary information. Managment, which in this facility was mostly Chinese....turned a blind eye.
The FIX WAS IN......
Too much is never enough
As you say the knock on made in japan was laughable at the time and well deserved. Sure they continued to get better and dominated by reverse engineering and "dumping" and today they make a great product despite a laughable and somewhat devious beginning. Well china is in the same spot, some laughable products, deceptive advertising, and outright knockoffs. China also makes good products..I toured a bearing factory that would rival any in the world but also toured an automotive brake manufacturer where they used the female end of a garden hose for a "go no-go" gage along with unsafe conditions like a breaker panel with threaded rod 2 feet long sticking out with circuits added along every inch of the rod totally uninsulated with the wire from those circuits laid out across roads with trucks driving over them constantly with raw materials siting in the elements getting dirty, rusty and damaged along side the road.
So the question you have to ask yourself is .... which facility did my $50 cable come from?
If the originals weren't such a ripoff in the first place, maybe no one would bother knocking them off.
The question becomes: did you really get Furutech outlets, or just something that looks like them?
NT
Ahhh pllllease.
If you prefer to pay the price of a motorcycle for a six outlets power strip, and the price of a car for a two meters interconnect, you do you.
I can finally afford great cables and stuff thanks to AliExpress. What I could afford BEFORE was ashamedly BAD. The whole Audiophile business is a little bit of a ripoff in itself, with prices escalating always farther in the "absolutely scandalous" amounts - especially for "accessories". I don't feel bad buying from China.
so, they bought you too
They've certainly bought me, my wife and I only drove Japanese or German designed cars, with a Hyundai Genesis ( Korean )thrown in for good measure.
Having worked as a former for an American Steel Company making parts for domestic vehicles, and watching upon more than one occasion as my much younger co-workers came back from lunch, either drunk?, or high as hell?, which lead to a lot of said parts being recalled weekly, I'd say don't blame cultures which only believe in partying after work, not during work hours, it's called attention to detail | pride in execution | growing as far as learning from, and taking advantage of said shared knowledge the Americans were bought into teach them, where oh where would to strive to be the first country to reach the moon would've been without Germany scientists?, or even the loans from China to assist us when funds become low?.
I've been more drawn to World History, as American History is based upon what?, a stolen land. Let's keep shit real shall we?, one is entitled to buy as they see fit, no?.
Personally I love the shit out of my Denafrips Pontus ll, and can only imagine how much more it'd have cost if built here?, or should I say like companies like Lexicon did in buying Oppo DVD Players, dressing them up underneath some heavier gauged faceplate and chassis and charging upwards of 3 times their original cost, as if they were doing us consumers a favor.
this was 20 years ago, mind you, and that's when it was primarily a US company and designed in USA, parts made here and in Japan. It was a wonderful studio tool then. Japan is our friend, they like us, we like them. South Korea too.
Whether you like it or not, we are just about finished as a country, be patient another year or 2. We really can't make anything anymore except maybe space rockets and weapons of war. It's really too bad we had to learn these lessons so late.
Don't worry, China has wanted world domination for many years and are soon to accomplish that. Enjoy your Pontus and cheers to ya!
We will all starve and suffocate and drown in tsunamis before it happens. Better enjoy what's left.
(I prefer my paranoia to yours).
Edits: 09/16/22
of course you do
How sad, that said things all have to come to an end..., as many merely want a better life for themselves | loved ones, while others seemingly always have a somewhat hidden agenda, usually funds stolen from their employees 401K and retirement plans, more often than not based upon the misguided trust of said employees.
I'm so happy that my wife and I are both retired, as years ago the writing of greed was on the walls, much like some form of graffiti, one merely needed to know how to look closer between the layer upon layer of paint to read it, loyalty towards one's employees is a thing of the past, it's all about corporate greed and self these days, all the small fry average joe types stand aside.
I'm also much much happier being more or less house ridden, as opposed to even going outdoors these days, hell the only things I miss, are visiting audio shops | a few friends and record shopping here and there, of which I've grown quite fond of downloads..., look Mom, no more scratches, nor extra room needed for storing records | not alone the wear and tear of vinyl playback itself.
One step forward | Three steps backwards it seems.
Cheers to you | your loved ones as well.
Only when the profits started to dwindle and Chinese were not willing to serve the problem emerged.
Lots of poetry here, in this thread. A credit to you all.
As a half American/half Asian Canadian national, Ima-plaid you all on your eloquence. A joy to read your thoughts.
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