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In Reply to: RE: Audioprism ground control posted by Quint on May 12, 2010 at 07:00:31
Quint,
That is strange, I thought the ground controls made a very large improvement.
I am using the top of the line Synergistic Apex Active shielding cables . So. perhaps with the active shielding that is what is making the differnence.
Edits: 05/12/10Follow Ups:
Not sure what makes the difference, Ozzy. Stephaen from Six Moons didn't hear any reliable difference, either. I guess it just depends on one's system and expectations. As the French say, "Vive le difference!"
One the opened devices look very unimpressive. Just a loop of fine wires. Two he liked the improvement in the sound stage, but he admits it is very subtle. I suspect this is one tweak that I will not try.
However, it will not always work on every speaker/amp/whatever. It is simply a loop of litz wire. You can make it for $5.00 a pair including the spades....heck, you do not even need the spades. If your speakers have massive binding posts and then massive wire to a xover and then massive wire to the driver you are going to probably hear nothing. If, like me you have no xover on your main driver and you solder the litz loop near the driver....oh my God....my speaker is now an electrostat! I also did a pair on my tweeter and it only made a small difference...but on the wide open woof/midrange....mind blowing.
There is a thread on Diyaudio.com come where the originator discusses them and how to make them. Also, I will have a page on my website soon describing them and showing pics of them made up. Read the reviews on Stereotimes.....they like them very much.....saying things like "best tweak for $150" .....how about if they cost $5.00?!!!! but, as I said, they will not work for everyone....but for $5.00 you cannot go wrong trying it.
I see no reason why this should have any bad interactions with a zobel network or anything else.
Thanks!
I managed to find said thread and I'm in the midst of reading the posts and scratching my head and having a great time. This is the very sort of bizarreness that just sends me and that I find a fascinating facet of the hobby! And like you say, there's really no downside. I'm not clear yet if the build is actually a single loop squished together with the two ends connected to the lug or if it's effectively a bunch of hairpin loops with 2N leads connected to the lug, but I expect it will be soon.
What fun!
Rick
a
Well Norm, I read all 362 posts of http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/parts/102180-groundside-electrons.html.
Finally about post 300 someone posted a drawing that was clear and Bud (apparently the promulgator of this maryann) said it was right. The upshot is that each wire forms a loop that is connected to the lug at both ends. It looked like that was the case in most pictures and it is, but apparently they also work without doing that.
Interesting read. It doesn't make a whit of sense to me but in this case that actually means that I'm in the mainstream. The general gist is 'this doesn't make any sense, but it does seem to work'. Maybe it's electrons? Maybe it leprechauns? Which of course makes it nearly irresistible so as soon as I unearth my workbench (so far only the legs are in view) I'm gonna play with it. What a great hobby!
Rick
If it doesn't matter whether the wires in the loop are individually attached or not, does it matter how big the loop is?
I faced the issue of nothing but trial and error with quartz disks to get a good effect some time ago. Sorry, I am just too old for this.
Six inches seems to be the recommended length. But then again maybe 2 feet of lamp cord would do it on speakers enough to convince one that something's happening. For a really good turn you use heatshrink in a few places, but it matters exactly how much you use and where you put the pieces, but if you slit it with a knife it matters less or is more stable or something, and so on.
I think the idea is to get you to try almost anything as it may have an effect which would motivate you to look further into it. And that's the level I'm at just now. I can easily build something sufficiently similar to the ones known to work and see what happens.
I don't understand the explaination very well, it's not really an explaination so much as a notion and the notion is your gear's ground runs low on electrons and attaching the chunks of fine wire to it's ground is going to provide a 'pool' of plump electrons to draw from. But it doesn't work if your board has a 'poured' ground plane and it makes things worse if hooked to digital ground. And so on, in other words it's TBD. Actually it really seems closer to BS than TBD but a lot of seemingly reasonable folks have verified the effect so I want to try too, I'm as seemingly reasonable as the next guy...
Many have speculated that RF pickup by the pigtail may be a factor and of course that sounds safer to me than believing in an electronic slush fund, but who knows? None of it makes logical sense to me at this point so I'll reserve speculations or opinions until I have something to go on.
Could this be green? If it helps supply electrons to your stereo, just imagine how much it would reduce your electric bill if you attached little wire tassels to the screws on all your wall switches. For one thing no one would have the guts to turn on the light fearing electrocution which should translate into a substantial savings.
Rick
a
If the litz wires are coated with only polyurethane (no heavy nylon coating) then you can easily remove it with a large soldering iron and Wonder solder (Wonder solder has more active flux than most solders...you can also stick the end of the litz wire in some Cardas soldering paste...or other flux...and use other solders). Simply hold the flat portion of the soldering iron tip(running as hot as possible)directly against the end of the wire.....after it gets so hot that you almost have to drop the wire (if you were holding it bare handed) then simply feed in the wonder solder and the coating will start to bubble off. It certainly is a couple of seconds faster to use a solder pot....but at a serious expense. I will have pictures on my site on how to solder the wires.
The litz wire that is used by the designer is a type one (just a twisted bundle) litz consisting of 140 strands of 40 gauge wire (about 18 gauge total). He used that wire because he had it around. There are no rules here. Have fun! The wire I am using is probably around 15 gauge total (probably a couple hundred strands of what looks like around 32 gauge). and is a type two litz (rope lay). The wire used by the designer is 6 inches long and folded back....he uses three pieces of heat shrink on it....I use cotton ties. again, I will have pics. Check out the review on 6 moons for a nice pic or what he does. The designer feels it needs a little heatshrink for best sound and he even suggests slitting the heatshrink lengthwise for best sound. I personally think he is damping the type one litz (which would like to unfold) with the heatshrink.....when I first did an experiment on the rca jacks in my modded Oppo it sounded horrible without damping the wires....so, me thinks he is mostly damping the wires with the heatshrink....but, again....no rules here.
a
I wish I were an electron and then I could tell you what happens to me as I pass by the litz wires.....but alas, I am not.
The perpetuator of this tweak feels it acts as a ground pool of electrons....simulating a monster ground plane. This is why he uses litz wire, in order to create a lot of surface area for the electrons to dance in....he he....
It turns out that how you damp the wires and insulate them and how many you use, etc. all effect the sound. I happened to have some heavy gauge litz wire from B-P-T that I used. Currently (always subject to change) I use the litz wire naked with two pieces of cotton string holding them together to damp them. I will have some pics on my website within the week.
Ric, What is your current website address?
nt
Could it be that you are simply attaching an antenna to your speaker, which picks up interference (RF, EMI) and makes it sound like there is more soundstage due to added noise?
Many users are mislead into thinking that added 'detail' and 'air' indicate improved fidelity.
A little added RF noise, IME, creates the illusion of more detail and air at the expense of the true detail present in the recording. A good example is the tremolo in Ella Fitzgerald's singing in her duet album with Louis Armstrong. RF noise suppresses this aspect of her performance.
A small amount of RF noise enhances amusical details by adding spurious treble energy. It takes disciplined listening to separate such results from the improved musicality that results from reduced RF noise.
Didn't do much for me.
How about a DIY version?
I bet hanging a rabbit's foot keychain on one's speaker terminals would have an even more positive effect.
-Increased reproduction.
-Thump so good that you'll hop around the listening room.
-Female vocalists will sound more warm and fuzzy.
-The backgrounds will be dead quiet.
Who want's wiry sounding speakers when you can have organic?
Rick
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