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In Reply to: RE: dumb beginner questions! considering a tuner. posted by old Bob on May 06, 2018 at 09:57:19
WCRB puts out 27K watts with and antenna height of 199 meters over terrain.I respect Eli a ton but get a tuner first as you'll likely pick that station up fine with full quieting with a dipole wire antenna ($5) laying on the floor behind your gear.
As to tuners the diminishing curve for used is $500 or so. That said there's a pristine Mac tuner it's $900 and from a trusted source. See the Asylum trader.
I'm a ham and love building antennas and if you're into do build the rhombic. Still 99.5 will be a can of corn to receive.
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
Edits: 05/06/18 05/06/18Follow Ups:
As "ham" you know RF better than me. I suggested the rhombic as being "idiot resistant", regardless of the tuner the OP buys.
FWIW, a thoroughly reconditioned Dyna FM3 combined with a rhombic antenna could be a very nice match with the man's tubed integrated amp.
On, the new equipment front, this item from a respected manufacturer is not a "sticker shock" inducer.
Eli D.
Yes I just got the power and height , should be easy. Unless he has alluminum siding and/or a metal roof.I totally agree on the antenna choice if he needs one. TVfool.com is a great site to predict reception both on TV and FM. They make a cool graph free that charts a predicted reception based on your location and even factors terrain between you and all the transmitters. Also gives station data. Try it at the link.
I mentioned Rods Mac cuz the OP mentioned Mac and it's super clean. That and Rod wouldn't sell someone a problem. That Mac is a DX'ers favorite and has a cool design.
You know more electronics and circuit design than I ever will. I love tubes too.
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
Edits: 05/07/18
THANKS GUYS!
now i get it!! i am still in the learning curve!! i do somewhat understand that wcrb is 27,000 watts and 600 foot antenna. that sounds like i will EASILY get the signal with a dipole wire (whatever that is) but $5 and laying on the floor will make my wife happy!!!!
sounds like i do NOT need a new $4500 McIntosh tuner! lots of options for me!!
i may say i really do not listen to AM much, and mostly wcrb and 98.5 the sports hub in boston. i bet 98.5 is plenty strong for me to receive.
https://985thesportshub.com/
further dumb questions:
1. should i fear an OLD McIntosh tuner? how in the world could i get it fixed? i always wanted a McIntosh component!! ha! an old dream! silly, really.
2. can you all suggest NEW tuners, that would work for me, for say $1,000 and less?
i may say that the Harbeth speakers are beyond amazing AT ANY PRICE!! immediate and total upgrade of my system. thanks so much, i welcome ANY comments.
best regards,
bob
I have 2 Mac tuners a tube MR-67 and a ss MR-74
both sound great both should get re-capped but no problems so far
i have had other ss tuners but the MAcs sound the best
THANKS everyone!
i just ordered a McIntosh mr 71 from tom manley, from macintosh audio. he seems quite honest, and the tuner should work, right out of the box. aligned, etc.
will let you all know!
best,
and THANKS
bob
I have little doubt it will bring you years of satisfaction.
As you noted, please keep us updated.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
If your heart is set on a McIntosh tuner (I know mine was!) they are still serviceable. McIntosh is still in business (albeit with new owners), and you can find a McIntosh repair center near you via their site. Terry DeWick seems to be the consummate Mac repair man, especially for their tuners.
If you're looking to learn more about tuners in general, or information for a spicific model, I've found the Tuner Information Center to be a wealth of good information regarding RF (radio frequency) performance, sonics (a subjective impression of how the tuner sounds), and the quality and reliability of various tuners.
Also, the FM Fool is a great site for both showing you what stations are available in your area, their distance from your house, and where to best aim your antenna to receive them.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
TV/FM fool is the shit! Use it all the time.
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
THANKS SO MUCH GUYS!! lots for me to learn!!!!
i would LOVE an old McIntosh, if it would dependably work!
happy listening!!!
bob
While I love tube tuners-
The MR 74 and 77 should not be over looked
Both are SS
the -74 is AM & FM
The -77 is FM only
The -74 is the better unit and is worth getting IMO (I have two)
There are also lots of other stations in your 'neck o' the woods'
If you are on a hill, you should also be able to get the college stations from Boston, Lowell, Worcester, Keene & Durham.
Have fun -
Happy Listening
P.S.
where would i buy a used McIntosh tuner that has been serviced and is working GREAT!!
thanks
bob
...I'd be emailing Mr. DeWick and asking him that question.
That said, there seems to be a list of McIntosh tuners for sale at the McIntosh Audio site (link below). In the left column there is an index, with a "McIntosh for sale" button. Scroll down the list for "Tuners". I'd be sure and ask them if its been serviced by Mr. DeWick prior to paying those kinds of prices though.
I've never had any dealings with Audio Classics , but many swear by them, especially for Mac gear. They don't come cheap though.
Also, as Awe-d-o-file mentioned, Rod M, the owner of this very Asylum is selling his McIntosh MR-78 in the Asylum Trader . I've included a link to all the tuners for sale, but you can find his MR-78 among the list. It might not sound quite as good as Eli's recommended MR-67 or MR-71 tube tuners, but should offer better RF performance, if specs are any indication. Also, tube tuners sometimes require re-alignment when it comes time for certain tubes in them to be replaced. Just something to keep in mind for long-term maintenance costs, although if you buy from a reliable source with good tubes installed, the tubes will likely outlive all of us.
I'll also echo Eli's recommendation of a Dynaco FM-3, especially if you're good at working on your own tube equipment. My FM-3 is my most pleasant to listen to tuner, and there seems to be one of them for sale in the Asylum Trader at the moment too. I have no affiliation with any of these items for sale, or places selling or servicing them. Just offering my 2¢
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
You clearly show the truth of TANSTAAFL. The SS tuner has a more sensitive front end, but comes up a tad short in the sound quality dept. While the tube tuners have THE sound, but need superior antennas to achieve max. performance."You can't win, you can't break even, and you can't quit the game."
Eli D.
Edits: 05/07/18
Exactly. I remember plugging and HFT-90 to my cheap receiver in high school. Even then the difference was quite clear. The audio rules on tube tuners. They do need a better antenna too as you said.
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
I have had a Mac MR 71 as modified by Rich Modafierri (sp?) from Audio Classics, an MR 71 rebuilt by my local technician with new power supply, an alignment, and new electronics as needed. I have this in house now. I also have a Mac 1700 receiver with a tube tuner section, also rebuilt locally with a new power supply, alignment, and new electronics as needed. The 1700 was modified a bit so the tuner section can be output by itself if needed. This allows the tuner section to be compared as a stand alone unit.
Mini review: The sound quality of the ModMod 71 and the local are about the same, they both have original tubes. The DXing on the ModMod is better than the local in terms of alternate channel selectivity. Otherwise, they are about the same. The ModMod DXing is about as good as the transistor tuners I have heard, but the local is not far behind.
The 1700 tuner section is also superb in sound, giving that "hearing back to the source feeling" that makes the Mac tube units so fine. DXing is again one step below the local MR 71, once again in channel selectivity.
The amp section of the 1700 is terrific after the rebuild, with a strong bass that is clear without being muddy or thuddy, as some earlier Mac transistor amps can be.
I recommend getting a 1700, have a rebuild with a way to separate the tuner as I have done. You also get a really good amp as a spare. I paid $650 for the 1700 that included a slant leg walnut case (Audiogon). The rebuild was about $400, for a total investment of $1000. That's a lot of stereo equipment for the price. Agree with Eli and others word for word about the comparative sound quality and DXing of high end tuners.
I have read that the MR78 is very good (transistor), also the MR 74 (transistor), but have never heard them. The MR73 (trans.) doesn't seem to get much love, but I don't know why.
LowIQ
...But now that I have, ain't that the truth?When I first moved to the South, the two things I missed about living in Western New York were the food, and the radio stations. I bought my MR-78 to be able to receive as distant a signal as possible, using a directional Yagi mounted on my roof. I was going for two bigger cities somewhat in my area, in an attempt to find more music to my liking.
Performance trumped (Quick, someone alert the moderator!) sound quality at that time. Not that the MR-78 sounds bad, but not as euphonic as my FM-3 does. An example of exemplary DX performance with bad sound would be my
Sony XDR-F1HD. Not awful, but nowhere near my MR-78 or FM-3 with regard to musical enjoyment.
"Suddenly, I'm not half the man I used to be. 'Cause now I'm an amputee" J. Lennon
Edits: 05/08/18
If you want a McIntosh tuner, go for a MR67 or MR71. They are tubed and have fabulous sound. Terry DeWick is but 1 person known for the ability to make "Mac" tube tuners 100%. A well maintained Dyna FM3 is the lowest cost entry into good tubed FM. Tube tuners need decent antennas, for best quieting. However, once that hurdle is gotten over, the sound you get justifies whatever grief was endured. FWIW, some "wag" made a remark about the superior sound of tube tuners being related to the transformer tuned IF strips employed. All modern SS tuners employ ceramic filters in the IF strip.
A $1000 budget is very generous for a current product. In my previous post, I linked a $200 Denon that is likely to be all you need. Here's a $250 Yamaha that might have a better SOAF factor (no rack mount "ears").
Eli D.
theres a rougher 71 in the trader for $500
ET
"If at first you don't succeed, keep on sucking till you do suck seed" - Curly Howard 1936
THANKS!!!!
OK, i am starting my research.
I want the BEST SOUND from my tuner, since my main stations are quite powerful. i want NO MAINTENANCE for several years. i checked that out with my NEW tube integrated amp, and the tubes should last quite a little while.
I want to have the antenna in the room only, which SHOULD be OK
questions:
1. old vs. new tuner
2. solid state vs. tubes.
i may say i AM willing to buy an old McIntosh tuner, solid state or tubes, but only if it will work for quite a while. from my reading, i am NOT up to "align" a tuner!!
in a perfect world i would just buy a new $4500 McIntosh tuner. too much money. i do like old things, and would get an old tube amp, that is READY TO GO!!
thanks!
McIntosh Audio seems to have gear that is ready to go and one year warranty. sounds good to me. it would be cool to have an old Mac tuner!
best regards,
bob
If you plan on putting a directional antenna in your attic you should be aware that it will be very hard to find one since most of them are discontinued.
Edits: 05/10/18 05/10/18 05/10/18
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