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In Reply to: RE: Ha! It looks like. . . posted by Jim F. on December 23, 2009 at 11:02:52
But note, as I said in another post, that iZotope SRC and/or iZotope MBIT processing didn't run properly under batch converter due to a bug in Soundforge (version 10.0a). I would download the trial version and make sure it is to your liking. When the free trial expires you can activate it by purchasing a key for $340 from the product web site.
Now the bad news: the Sony Noise Reduction 2 package is grossly inferior to what comes in iZotope RX, in terms of user interface, features, functions and sound quality. If you are doing clean up of damaged analog media you will do a better job in a tiny fraction of the time by using RX. In particular, the spectrogram plots make it easy to locate imperfections on the audio such as clicks, ticks, pops, and dropouts and then easily do a surgical repair. So you will be out another $350 or so for the basic version of RX. (Or $1200 for the advanced version which I have been using since last summer.)
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
Follow Ups:
> But note, as I said in another post. . .
Hope they fix that soon. But otherwise,
the Batch Converter in Sound Forge 10 seems to work
pretty well. I tried it today.
Also, while the built-in iZotope functions may not be
working properly in batch, that doesn't seem to be
preventing the Ozone 4 VST plug-in from working correctly there.
Just out of curiosity -- do you happen to know if the
latest Sound Forge supports native 64-bit processing? I **don't**
mean x86-64 code, I mean 64-bit double-precision
floating point interfaces to plug-ins (a distinction
which seems to be lost on most of the people asking
and attempting to answer similar questions on the forums).
Cakewalk Sonar makes a big deal about its 64-bit
engine and the fact that it supports 64-bit floating-point
WAV files. I was surprised to discover that Sound Forge
also supports 64-bit WAV files, and that its bit-depth
converter has "64-bit IEEE float" in the menu.
But I can't find out anywhere if, for example, Ozone 4
(which purports to be a 64-bit plug-in, in the double-precision
sense) is really getting 64-bit floats in and sending 64-bit
floats out if Sound Forge is the host.
I'm a little dubious, because I also have access to
a machine with the older Sound Forge 8 on it, which will
also read and write 64-bit floating-point WAV files, but when
you load Ozone 4 in **its** Batch Converter, the Ozone interface
screen has a little display in the lower right-hand
corner that says "%CPU (at 24-bit processing)"
What's with the "24-bit processing"?
However, this text, on the same Ozone 4 panel, is
absent in Sound Forge Pro 10. And presumably it's
coming from Ozone 4 itself.
Do you suppose that the ". . . (at 24-bit processing)"
that shows up on Ozone 4's control panel in Sound Forge 8
is an alert from Ozone that it's on a
narrower-than-64-bit data path?
I have no idea about how the Soundforge plug ins are interfaced. It might be possible to do various tests and see what level of noise and distortion was present in the output. I have done a few tests at 32 bits, but none at 64 bits. I don't think the test signals that Soundforge creates start out at 64 bits. And the FFT routines don't have the required resolution either. It would probably require special software to determine if there is a complete 64 bit path. As I don't use 64 bits (it seems a bit much with 24 bit converters and source matterial coming from cassette tape) I haven't given any priority to this effort. Keep in mind that the DSP modules do tens of thousands of operations on a sample and so benefit from double precision floating point. It does not mean that their input-output transfer is accurate to 64 bits.
I can barely hear down to 16 bits in my (noisy) room at the maximum gain settings that I ever use for normal listening (e.g. to Temirkanov's Mahler 5). So it is hard to motivate much worry beyond the 24 bit level. In any event, when I am using plug-ins it is to fix something wrong on an old analog recording that has noise at most 60 dB down.
Tony Lauck
"Diversity is the law of nature; no two entities in this universe are uniform." - P.R. Sarkar
> I have no idea about how the Soundforge plug ins are interfaced.
I just discovered a nifty utility -- something I'd been
hoping to find.
There's a 64-bit VST bit meter called "Schwa Bitter". It's free,
from:
http://www.stillwellaudio.com/?page_id=33
This is the only bit meter I've seen that goes all the way
to 64 bits.
You can use it to see what your other plugins (and your DAW's
processing engine) are doing to the bit depth. Just load
a file, load Bitter anywhere in your Effects chain,
and start the file playing.
For instance, Sonar 8, if the "64-bit engine" is enabled,
not only reads and writes 64-bit floating-point files,
but if you do something like change the gain, all 64 bits
in the file **really are** active after that.
However, if you then read that same file into Soundforge 10
and start it playing, bitter will show only 32 of the 64 bits as
active.
Bitter itself is 64 bits in and 64 bits out, as you can
verify by loading multiple copies of it in Sonar 8.
(Sonar also indicates which of your VST plugins are 32 bit
and which are 64 bit, by putting hash marks in the
little FX window underneath the name of the plugin.
Two hash marks for stereo 32-bit, four hash marks for
stereo 64-bit. Bitter shows with the expected 4 hash
marks.
Interestingly, while iZotope Ozone 4, billed as a
"64-bit plug-in", and which also shows up with 4 hash
marks when loaded in Sonar 8, **only** ever outputs
32 bits, according to Bitter.
Maybe Ozone is inputting 64 bits (or maybe not), and
presumably it's processing internally at 64 bits,
but I guess it expects to be the last thing in your
chain.
As you say, none of this is earth-shatteringly significant,
but it's fun to see what's going on.
I suppose you could even load Bitter in something like
Foobar, with the appropriate VST wrapper
(Maybe foo_dsp_vstwrap.dll
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=59206
No, I haven't tried it.)
> There's a 64-bit VST bit meter called "Schwa Bitter". . .
Apparently Mr. Schwa is one of (or maybe the chief) developer
behind a multitrack DAW called "Reaper" -- competition for
the likes of Sonar and Nuendo (and Pro Tools?)
[Well, "REAPER is a Digital Audio Workstation software made
by Cockos. The team at Cockos is Justin Frankel (of Winamp
and Gnutella fame), Christophe and Schwa." from the
"Reaper User Group - RUG" page on Facebook.]
A non-commercial (personal use) license is only $60.00.
And even the full license is only $225.00. Runs on
32-bit or 64-bit Windows, from 98 through 7; and on
OS-X (even the PowerPC version).
http://www.cockos.com/reaper/download.php
Funny thing about "Bitter", though. I have one PC on
which it refuses to load. Not under Reaper, Sonar,
WaveLab 5 or WaveLab 6.
Other PCs have no problem. The only obvious difference
among the computers is that the "cranky" one is
an Athlon; all the others are newish Intels.
Maybe Bitter needs some flavor of SSE not available
on the Athlon. If so, it's not in the documentation.
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