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I recently bought some speakers that sound as good as anything I've owned thus far. Moreover, they aren't all that expensive considering the high quality sound they provide.
These speakers are Magnepan Mini Maggie's with an extra DWM bass panel. They normally come with only one bass panel for desktop placement; however, for room placement you'll need a second bass panel. The price in this configuration with the second bass panel is $3,490.
My Mini Maggie's are being driven by a pair of PS Audio Stellar M1200 monoblock amplifiers. These cost $6,998 a pair, and they produce truly exceptional sound quality in conjunction with the Mini Maggie speakers when set up in an ultra near-field configuration as shown in the pictures below.
Surprisingly, the soundstage is quite large with wonderful depth and holographic imaging. Unfortunately, the appearance might not impress the wife, but the sound quality is absolutely fantastic. You have to hear it to believe it!
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Follow Ups:
"Are you into audio strictly for the sound quality?"
For me, that is a very interesting question!
As a high school student playing trumpet in the orchestra and concert band, I decided to major in music and become a high school band director. But even back then, I was intrigued by the man who recorded our high school concerts. He had two Ampex 602-2 tape recorders, Neumann and Sony condenser microphones, and... a Scully cutting lathe in his home. It didn't take me long to go out and buy a Roberts (Akai) tape recorder and a pair of Electro-Voice microphones. Anyway, ...
In college, I was always the guy doing sound reinforcement, and recording recitals. Being a music major, I was keenly aware of the sound quality, and the room acoustics. The handwriting was on the wall. I broadened my studies to include audio and acoustics, joined the AES and ASA, and ended up working in those fields. (Never did become a band director.)
So, yes, I'm "into" audio for the sound quality, because I get a total kick out of hearing good sound!
*********
We are inclusive and diverse, but dissent will not be tolerated.
Yes, I'm mainly in it for sound quality but with practical and budget constrains.Starting from scratch I'd go with this system:
- Mini PC or modest laptop as streamer using Foobar2000 as my music player
- miniDSP SHD as preamp and EQ
- Genelec G Three's as main speakers (or if I felt richer, Genelic 8331A's
- Genelec 7350A as subwoofer
Dmitri Shostakovich
Edits: 02/13/24 02/13/24
Yep. I am a big maggie fan and was running a heavily modded pair of mmgs with magwires for speaker cables....long story but because there is no box you can get tiny speaker wires and get awesome sound.
Forced to do headphones now but have been thinking about some mini mags and maybe one day I can get the mmgs out of storage. That looks like an awesome nearfield setup. I actually had mine sideways...
Lucky you
Cut to razor sounding violins
Went through way too much equipment over the years to get to where I'm satisfied. Moving some years back also caused a complete overhaul of the system, in large part due to the new room acoustics.
Current primary setup has a Devialet 1000 Pro amp setup, with ATC SCM 40 V2 speakers, and a SVS PC 4000 subwoofer. The Speaker Active Matching (SAM) software embedded in the 1000 Pro really opens up the ATC speakers.
The integration between the Devialet and the ATC speakers sounds amazing. To attempt to improve the sound would be cost prohibitive.
" Don't look back. Something may be gaining on you"
Satchel Paige
... a set of headphones with 600 watts / side driving them. Trippy that they outdo your old Thiels.
No--I'm into it for the music. I've got some decent systems and even some very nice equipment in my main system, but I've actually previously owned "better"--more "resolving" or "accurate".
But my taste in music is diverse, and a lot of it involves older live recordings (with all of their inherent flaws). It's about the performance and energy, not necessarily the purity/quality. No--I don't have a bin full of Dead bootleg cassettes, but I have pretty-much every Live at the Fillmore album ever released on vinyl--and many other live performances from a diversity of artists/genres/venues.
A "great" recording on a highly resolving system sounds great, and can bring tears to your eyes. But OTOH, a "marginal" recording on a highly resolving system can also bring tears to your eyes--for a totally different reason. ALL you hear/focus-on are the short-comings and flaws, and the music gets lost due to the "distractions".
A fair portion of my album collection (3600+) was acquired during the "great transition" to digital--when people were ditching (in some cases, literally giving-away) vinyl to move-on to CDs, and eventually downloads/streaming. Some are like new--others were not so meticulously curated--they're used albums--you deal with what you get. Clean them up (as best you can)--some are keepers--some are trash(ed).
It's all a matter of what you want/expect/accept. I want the music. If I have to sacrifice the holy grail of accuracy/detail to make it listenable, I will and do. That's the purpose of different systems for different recordings.
Repeated on many audio forums--it only matters if it sounds good to YOU.
"And today is for sale and it's all you can afford. Buy your own admission. The whole things got you bored. Well the Lord chooses the good ones, and the bad ones use the Lord"--a very dear friend for decades Michael Stanley (Gee)--RIP
I don't much care about the sq of the recording if the music itself is good. Granted, it's very nice to have older music restored using modern tech to remove imperfections. Similarly, new music which is superbly recorded but which is boring or annoying is of no interest to me. I do find it somewhat amusing that certain recordings continually have new remasters issued on a semi-regular basis - Kind of Blue by Miles Davis comes immediately to mind. No amount of remastering from whatever source material is going to make this recording interesting.
Lack of skill dictates economy of style. - Joey Ramone
I know what you mean about good music. I used to play a clarinet and my favorite clarinetist was Pete Fountain. I can listen to his recordings regardless of sound quality. He never made an audiophile recording and the sound quality on some of his records is rather poor. However, I love his jazz so much that sound quality is almost totally unimportant to me. I haven't heard a Pete Fountain record yet that I didn't love.
On the other hand, I truly enjoy high-end audio and for most other music, sound quality is very important to me. I used to buy a lot of direct-to-disc records and other audiophile pressings. Some of the music on these was pretty awful and I find it difficult to listen to some of them. However, if the sound quality weren't topnotch, I probably wouldn't listen to most of them again. Therefore, sound quality is important to me because it allows me to enjoy some music that I might not otherwise enjoy. It also allows me to gain greater enjoyment from the music I really like.
Anyway, my rationale for starting this thread is to recommend some speakers that I feel have exceptional sound quality for their very reasonable price. I've known about Magnepan speakers for years, but for some odd reason I never owned a pair until now. I didn't buy the cheapest Magnepan speakers, but the ones I bought aren't very expensive yet they produce spectacular sound quality for their reasonable price. For example, I now seem to enjoy listening to my $3,490 Mini Maggie's even more than my $14,700 Thiel CS3.7 speakers.
Happy listening!
John Elison
for you to participate at Planar now that you've discovered one. There's a wealth of knowledge to be found there.
I didn't even know there was a Planar Speaker Asylum. I'll check it out.
or is it DWM's + box subs configuration.
I'm sure you are getting great results with Maggies because of your stout and expensive PS Audio amp, thus confirming the audio folklore that Maggies come with "hidden" amplification costs :)
I use a single 12" Rythmik Servo Sub with my Mini Maggie's. The DWM panel is a woofer that doesn't do much below 40-Hz. Therefore, I use one of my Rythmik Servo Subs to handle the frequencies from 20-Hz to 50-Hz. I have its low-pass filter set for 50-Hz.
I think you might be right about Magnepan speakers having "hidden" amplification costs. I tried them with a PS Audio Stellar S300 amplifier and they didn't sound nearly as good. Therefore, I think the Stellar M1200 monoblocks are needed for the best sound quality.
On the other hand, my Thiel's also needed the PS Audio Stellar M1200 monoblocks to sound their best. I thought the Parasound Halo A21 sounded very good until I switched to the M1200 monoblocks, which improved the sound of my Thiel's significantly.
Happy listening!
John Elison
I'm getting claustrophobic just looking at it...
I only use near-field on my desktop system,
and it's all in front of me, not surrounded.
I wouldn't care for that!
it sounds like he uses them in MID-Field.
Near Field behind a mixing console is what engineers use to minimize the room effects and still have freedom to move around while listening and mixing tracks. Mid-Field is a compromise between Near and Far and is best for smaller rooms and also for more intimate settings for listening.
I've been using Mid-Field for many years. You should try it sometime
Well, I call my system ultra near-field. I guess it depends on your point of view.
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now that's an Easy Chair John, enjoy the Tunes
...it would be behind you! Glad to hear that you're enjoying your new toys, John!
You have to hear it before you criticize it. It's the sound quality that I live for and this is my most enjoyable sounding system to date.
To each his own!
Nt.
;)
all the best,
mrh
That was funny!
Music I love has the power to bring me to tears, regardless of what it's played on.
But that said, yeah, I do like good reproduction. And congrats on joining the Maggie gang. I've got a set of MMGs that I rilly, rilly like.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
Edits: 02/06/24
you will really love the LRSes.
Lack of skill dictates economy of style. - Joey Ramone
There's no question that both the MMG and LRS speakers are exceptional values. However, I bought the Mini Maggie's because I wanted a true three-way speaker system. The Mini Maggie's have a ribbon tweeter with a separate planar midrange driver in each small midrange/tweeter panel. Then they have separate larger woofer panels to handle frequencies from 40-Hz to 200-Hz. I'm also using a single 12" Rythmik Servo Sub to augment the bottom octave from 20-Hz to 40-Hz.
nt
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
The LRS is the same height as the MMG, but slightly narrower and thinner. Wouldn't that improve Wife Acceptance Factor?
Edits: 02/06/24
The search for good sound quality is something I think all audiophiles strive for. Isn't that part of the definition of an audiophile? Anybody with earbuds can listen to music, but that sort of sound would probably not suit audiophiles. OTOH, there are probably plenty of audiophiles who would rather listen through earbuds than listen to traffic when out of the house.
John, didn't you have Thiels' latest effort? Do you still have them? How do they rank against your new Maggies?
I have an audio buddy who has a pair of Teckton Design Perfect SET loudspeakers. For under $2,000, they are incredibly good.
Cheers
> John, didn't you have Thiels' latest effort? Do you still have them? How do they rank against your new Maggies?
Yes, I had Thiel CS3.7 floor-standing speakers. In fact, I still have them packed in their boxes in my garage. I dismantled my system a couple of years ago to do some renovations to my home.
My Thiel's sound very good, but different from my Mini Maggies. Both speaker systems provide exceptional sound quality. Perhaps it's not fair to say the Mini Maggie's sound better than the Thiel's because they both impress me and I could live with either pair for the rest of my life. The simplest way to describe the difference is that the Thiel's sound like high-end solid state electronics whereas the Mini Maggie's sound like high-end vacuum tubes.
I originally bought the PS Audio Stellar M1200 monoblock amplifiers to improve the sound of the Thiels and that worked beautifully. I'd never heard my Thiel's sound better than when I installed the M1200 monoblocks. These amplifiers are the best I've ever owned and I'm currently using them with my Mini Maggies. As a result, I believe I enjoy the Mini Maggie's just slightly more than I enjoyed my Thiel's. However, they're both topnotch speakers. Besides sounding like vacuum tubes, another advantage to the Mini Maggie's is their price. The Thiel's retailed for $14,700 and my Mini Maggie's retailed for $3,150 when I bought them seven months ago. They've gone up a little to $3,490 since then.
Happy listening!
John Elison
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John Elison,
For me the magic combo was Thiels 'n tubes. I loved my 3.7s on my CJ Premier 12 tube monoblocks (140W/side). They maintained that vividness and sonic density I loved in the Thiels, but rounded out and warmed up the sound so it was both dynamic, precise and organic.
I only sold them due to their size, visually, and replaced them with the slightly smaller 2.7s which sound very similar. (I also added Joseph Audio Perspective 2 graphene speakers which I love too).
When I replaced my Parasound Halo A21 power amplifier with the PS Audio Stellar M1200 monoblocks, the sound of my Thiel's improved significantly. This combo was magic just like yours. However, I decided to refurbish my listening room so I dismantled my stereo system. Before I got around to setting it back up, a friend recommended I buy some Magnepan Mini Maggie speakers. Like you said, the Thiel's are very heavy, so I decided to try the Mini Maggie's because they weren't all that expensive and my friend just loved them. It turns out, I liked them immediately, too. The more I listened, the more I liked the Mini Maggie's, so I decided to stick with them. My Thiel's are packed in their original boxes in my garage. Although they might sound as good as the Mini Maggies, I'm enjoying the Mini Maggie's slightly more than I remember enjoying the Thiel's, which are too heavy to set up again.
I think you made a good choice with the CS2.7 speakers. I often thought they might sound just about as good as the CS3.7 speakers as long as you incorporated a subwoofer. In fact, even the CS3.7 speakers required a subwoofer in my opinion. The thing that makes both of these speakers sound so good is the midrange/tweeter driver, which is identical on both of them.
Anyway, I really lover my Mini Maggie's so I'll probably sell my Thiel's eventually.
Best regards,
John Elison
I actually tried subs with the 2.7s (2 JL Audio subs, their expensive crossover, added room correction etc) and preferred the Thiels without the subs.
I know what it's like to be besotted by a more modest set up too. For instance, I have a pair of old Thiel 02s, circa early 80s, Thiels cheapest box speakers they ever made before even going time/phase coherent. Yet they do certain things that I like more than any other speaker. And whenever I thrown them in my system I think "my god I enjoy this so much, why would I need anything else?"
But after a while the shine comes off when I'm not getting things I know my "better" speakers can do, and so they go back in storage until I repeat the experience later on :-)
My Thiel CS3.7's sounded better and better for the whole first year I owned them. After that, they sounded fantastic every time I listened.
However, I needed a subwoofer. In fact, a pair of 12" Rythmik Servo Subs sounded awesome with my Thiel's . They blended perfectly after adjusting the variable phase control so the subs matched the phase of the Thiel's.
I've now owned my Mini Maggie's for about seven months and they also sound fantastic each time I listen. I use a single 12" Rythmik Servo Sub with my Mini Maggie's.
In my situation, I think subwoofers sound best when placed very near my main speakers. Of course, they also have to be adjusted for phase and volume in addition to setting the low-pass filter correctly. Mine seems to work best when set to 50-Hz for both my Thiel's and my Mini Maggie's.
Happy listening!
John,
Thanks for this detail! I had a pair of Thiel 3.6s for a while, but if I remember correctly, I found them to be a little clinical for my taste. Fine speakers though for certain.
I also owned Magnepan 1.6QRs on a couple of different occasions. I have a sense of the Maggie sound which I remember as very beguiling. I'll bet Magnepan has made some significant improvements since those days!
All the best,
George
+1, I'll bet those Thiel's sound pretty good for watching old Westerns
Magnapan seemed to only set up at shows for a product launch (smart on wallet).
For the desktop launch , they had on the quarter hour presentations, but didn't tell what you were going to hear, and all of the setup was behind a room length black curtain.
As often happens with listening to Magnapans, much head shaking combined with the thought that "How can they get such quality performance with that low of a cost?"
That little setup had quite a few well-healed audiophiles second guessing their past purchases.
Would be interesting to slide into your "large format headphones" seat and take a ride.
just wait till you hear the big ones, especially the Stat's
Well, I'm pretty happy with my Mini Maggie's. They're the most enjoyable speakers I've owned thus far.
One of my audio buddies owns MBL speakers and amplifiers. He also owns a pair of Mini Maggie's and he told me he listens to his Mini Maggie's 80% of the time compared to his ultra-expensive MBL speakers. That's what convinced me to buy my Mini Maggie's and I couldn't be happier.
Best regards,
John Elison
Yes.
LowIQ
John
Great near field set up. Maggies and Rythmics subs go very well together.
I have LRS and one Rythmic 15 in sub tucked away on the left in a more typical set up.
Gsquared
I just discovered Magnepan speakers and they seem to be some of the best speakers available for the price. Yours are probably the very best value in speakers today.
Happy listening!
John Elison
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