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So I recently read an article on how the latest version of Kind of Blue is the best yet. Are we at the point where downloads and streaming sound as good as, or are better than great LP playback?
Follow Ups:
Oh yeah!
John Kuthe...
As far as sound quality goes ?
You still have to listen and compare for yourself. Don't take anyone else's word on it, just listen.
Since this thread has gone off in so many tangents....
Not directed at Ozzie specifically but:
- No one is forcing you to download your music.
- No one is forcing you to stream your music.
- No one is forcing you to make a choice.
You can have it all. Download, Stream, Keep your CDs, Rip your CDs, Keep your LPs, Rip your LPs.
Streaming is incredibly cost effective (cheap!) and the audio quality is superb, and the vast selection is mind boggling.
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Just listen to those that have never tried it.
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And that's only a partial list of ways to listen to (and ENJOY) recorded music.
Great post!
"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination" -Michael McClure
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I thoroughly enjoy both.
Open up your mind, in pours the trash. - Meat Puppets, 1987
Sorry, that was not directed at you Abe. Meant to be a general comment.
I agree completely with your post.
Open up your mind, in pours the trash. - Meat Puppets, 1987
You hit the nail on the head Abe but you leave no room for argument. That's the only reason we come here😁
I suspect they are, judging from dynamic range data base. For that reason I'm out.
But then again, I do think DAC performance, historically, has been disappointing...... Even with the improved stuff out there now.......
I mean, we should have digital sources that sound just like Telarc/Soundstream digital master LPs...... But we don't.
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The Loudness Wars produced CDs, SACDs, SHM CDs, Blu-ray Audio and hi res downloads that are dynamically over compressed. Vinyl escaped most of the aggressive compression because by the time the Loudness Wars began vinyl was being ushered out. Cassettes also preceded the Loudness Wars thus escaped overly aggressive dynamic compression.
follow and read the link, and also do a search for more even though most people won't bother to
the advent of CD took it up a notch or 2, but they still do it
What I'm referring to is Loudness Wars, I.e., the trade-off between loudness and dynamic range. Obviously most recordings are and have always been compressed to a certain degree.obviously unlimited dynamic range is not feasible for many reasons. But that's not rpt not what this discussion is about. It's about "flatlining" dynamic range. I.e., AVG MIN MAX all in the RED on the Dynamic Range Data Base. So your comment is actually, you guessed it, a logical fallacy. No offense.
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my point is they've been doing studio processing for a long time
Another logical fallacy. Everyone seems to know what the loudness Wars are except you.
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...-
The numbers represent relative dynamic range, but are not in dB. The Dynamic Range Data Base shows The numbers/color scale at top of page, green represents excellent dynamic range and red represents poor dynamic range. Numbers 14 and higher represent outstanding dynamic range. Orange is acceptable dynamic range. For each album there are three colors/numbers - average, minimum and maximum dynamic range.
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One of these days I'll add an internet streaming option. I have plenty of hard copy storage and am still interested in collecting vinyl and CDs. Music lover, audiophile & record collector until the end.
Currently I'm set up to use a hard-drive as a lossless input to my hifi and am recording vinyl to cdrw and ripping those to a digital music library with CD rips as content for that hard drive. I'm using a local network to control the GUI. When I'm ready for hi-rez is when I'm going to establish an internet streaming source.
It's a low priority.
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Haven't used in so long that I can't remember the password, but IMO streaming is fine up to a point. I'd never rely on it as a substitute for a physical music collection.
Too many people I know do, however.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
I use it on my computer audio system - which isn't a high res or even high quality thing. Pretty sure everything I'm getting from the internet is lossy.
Then do what you want with it.
Your interest may vary but the results will be same. (Byrd 2020)
I can't compete with the dead. (Buck W. 2010)
Cowards can't be heroes. (Byrd 2017)
Why don't catfish have kittens? (Moe Howard 1937)
How do you record the digital stream? Yea sure I could record the analog output through my preamp via it's tape out and convert back to digital. I can also copy and edit digital files. But how do I copy a digital stream? There doesn't seem to be a copy option on my music players.When streaming music is there any ethical or legal consideration when it comes to copying digital streams? Isn't there a difference between downloading a song and streaming one?
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Audacity can be used to record a stream off the soundcard. You'll get one file with your choice of output format. Put it on a drive, burn to CD, etc.
Your interest may vary but the results will be same. (Byrd 2020)
I can't compete with the dead. (Buck W. 2010)
Cowards can't be heroes. (Byrd 2017)
Why don't catfish have kittens? (Moe Howard 1937)
I keep physical cash under my mattress ;-)And I write checks in slow backed up grocery store lines if I forgot my cash.
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I keep a horse out back, in case my car won't start.
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Nt
Do you enjoy the distortions of LP or of digital? Take your choice.
Do you enjoy the constant fiddling and never-ending expenses of LP, or
the simple convenience of digital? Take your choice.
Do you like to get up every 20 minutes to turn over an LP? Or do you
prefer to sit for an hour or so listening to a CD (or even longer if
you stream)? Take your choice.
There is no "better". There is only "different".
Life is hard. It's harder when you're stupid.
Nt
And I wonder who that "One" might be ?
Yes, one wonders.
Been there, a drag!
Had the procedure now I 'stream' like I did when I drank beer in my 20's.
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What in the world are you talking about? I don't think checking the alignment of my cartridge once in the last six years is considered constant fiddling, and the only expense incurred relative to vinyl, other than the vinyl itself, were rice paper sleeves for new acquisitions. Sure some guys change the VTA for every record, but then there's the lazy audiophile like me who couldn't be bothered with such things.
voolston - audiophile by day, music lover by night!
I consider the need to clean both record and stylus for each play "fiddling". Still do it for the vinyl content I have that is unavailable on digital.
Last time I needed to clean the platters on the NAS' hard drives was, well - never. ;)
I still have a very small handful of vinyl LP's. I fire up the TT when I feel the fiddly ritual urge for:LEVEL #1
- Finding the LP in the first place!
- Carefully removing it from the sleeve.
- Placing it on the platter w/o mucking it up with finger prints.
- Finding my stylus brush and cleaning the stylus.
- Dousing the LP in fluid and cleaning it with the record brush.
- Gently placing the tonearm down trying not to literally drop it.
- Getting off my butt to manually flip to the B side.
- Putting it all away in the sleeve when done.
- Hopefully I've had my fill of vinyl rituals by this time.If I really need to immerse myself in the more fiddly rituals of record playing I will OCD-ly mess with:
LEVEL #2:
- Using my noisy big-ass VPI Record Cleaning Machine to clean my records.
- Dump the spent fluid down the drain or toilet.
- Re level the TT in all directions with a bubble level.
- Eyeball inspect the stylus under a magnifying loupe.
- Hope that there's life left in the stylus and it's not worn flat.
- Align the cartridge with a stylus alignment protractor.
- Check the damping fluid level for the tonearm.
- Adjust the Vertical Tracking Angle
- Adjust the tracking force in grams.
- Adjust the anti-skate.
- Recheck the gain and loading on my phono preamp.I'm usually convinced that I don't really enjoy playing LPs after a "LEVEL #1" session. I go to the "LEVEL #2" session only if I'm shaking from vinyl ritual deprivation. I'm usually BACK to STREAMING after a brief "LEVEL #1" session every few months.
Too bad we shouldn't open up our disk drives to clean them ;-) Good thing for music streaming services, we don't have to be concerned with disk drives at all.
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1. setting the table
1A. Placing the plate
1B. Placing the knife and fork
1C.Placing the glass for your beverage
2. Sitting at the table
2A. Serving the main dish
2B. Passing the plate
2C serving the side dishes
awe screw it. I can't do this! Way too much work
Let's not even start on going to a restuarant. That's an even longer list. You have to leave the house!!!
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My ritual:
1. Send out to Grub Hub to get a few Impossible Whoppers delivered
2. Pick up the delivery at my door
3. Unwrap each burger as needed
4. Start feeding my face
5. Throw away the wrappers
You mentioned going to a restaurant? WAY too much trouble!
So you have to get up and unwrap a burger every 20 minutes? Deal breaker
You have spelled out my frustrations with vinyl to a "T"!!!
Life is hard. It's harder when you're stupid.
You never own it, not even if you pay for a download. Streaming? Take a look at what's happening with Netflix and HBO+, shows disappearing right and left. That can and I'm sure will happen to your favorite tunes. I'd never rely solely on streaming for my music.
You can purchase music for download but unless you're savvy enough to store the file on something not connected to the web, the content provider can take the file back if there's a dispute with the content owner. This happens with e-books, and in one notorious case, the content provider terminated its service, shut down its e-book servers, and poof! Every book each customer purchased was gone.
And they don't even have to offer you a refund.
LPs are a pain in the ass to store, but at least you own them. You can share them whoever you want, record them to tape or hard drive, etc.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
nt
It created a world where people buy things but don't own them. Not just music, either.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
We're on the same page about that.But it's very easy to avoid DRM when buying audio recordings. I mostly buy from HDTracks and Qobuz. You do have to pay a little more than if you were buying from Apple or Amazon, but it's worth it to me because you get lossless and DRM-free FLAC files, same as if you had ripped them yourself from CD, and in many cases there is a hi-res version that's better.
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You still don't seem to understand, based on your comments. --- A CD is Digital File and so is a Download.....
I thought I had explained that one to you?
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We all understand that. Maybe step back and consider this crazy idea that perhaps YOU don't understand what it is that appeals to others about owning a tangible physical product like a CD or record.
I've been backing up my files, including music, for a couple of decades now. Your streaming service can't do anything to that material.
And one can also lose vinyl that can't be replaced. I've known a several people over the years who have lost collections and other possessions due to fires, floods, thefts, windstorms and other perils. At least with locally stored digital files, you have the option to keep an off premises backup if you choose to do so. That is not a practical solution for vinyl.
As for streaming, my experience has been the removal of material due to expired contracts has been miniscule compared to videos. Even then, there is still a world of material available on the used market if your streaming service happens to take something down.
Not just music, but all files.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
Not really an App but our iPhones and iPads are all automagically backed up to iCloud on a daily basis behind the scenes.
Lose our phones and lose our Contacts, Photos, Calendar Events, Apple Music, Emails, etc? Never!
For those who never make a conscience effort to backup, there's a solution. It's the Cloud. And I'm not just talking about Apple's iCloud.
Automate your backups to the Cloud and never worry about it.
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I also still know people who don't use seatbelts in spite of the proven record of reducing injury and death.
But, unlike with CDs and LPs, the option to backup music files is present and easily implemented if they choose to do so.
I'm an old fart too so don't be offended by that comment.
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I fear the Library will want their books back and I'll never be able to hoard them in my basement.
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With a library, it's understood that you don't own the books. With streaming and downloads, it's hidden in the fine print that nobody ever reads.
BTW, your favorite book isn't safe at a library either.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
it's hidden in the fine print that nobody ever reads.Hogwash. This from Qobuz. Note that if somehow I lost my purchase, I can download it again!
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And, HD Tracks:
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And what happens if Qobuz tanks? What happens if it shuts down its servers? You've read all the fine print in the EULA?
BTW, there's usually a clause in every EULA stating that terms and conditions can be changed without notice. What Qobuz offers today, it may no longer offer tomorrow.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
What happens if it shuts down its servers?
I cease paying for the streaming service. Is this something you don't understand?
What Qobuz offers today, it may no longer offer tomorrow.
And a meteor from outer space may terminate all life on Earth next year!
More importantly, WTF does any of that have to do with your positively ludicrous claim that these companies will capriciously delete files on your network legally purchased from them?
NOTHING!
Boy, you like to whine and bitch about everything!
RE Meteor: We can only hope. but I suspect we will do it ourselves before the Cosmic Muffin comes down and finishes us off....
Too much is never enough
What if, what if, what if, what if?Talk about streaming paranoia man!
What if I die with a basement full of LPs and CDs weighing a thousand pounds?
My wife would have to deal with it. My solution: I stream out of love for my wife. Honey, I want another streaming service because I love you! ;-)
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He's confused.
We know that Apple lead the way in the early days with the iTunes Store for legit paid-for music downloads. The main reason Apple embedded DRM in the downloads was to play nice and to appease the record labels. We have to remember that music downloads and pirating (Napster) were brand new and frightening stuff back then. Apple figured it would play nice with the labels to get their legit iTunes Store up and running.
According to WIRED Magazine:
" In 2009, Apple finally decided to drop DRM from the iTunes music library. That didn't help much with songs purchased before that decision, however. Fortunately, if you still have these crippled tracks sitting in your library, there's an easy way to kill the DRM with a few steps."
As for streaming, it's a given that you don't own what you stream and what you don't own can't be taken away. Pay the tiny monthly fee and have access to millions of tunes..... many in CD quality or better.
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Tomorrow, who knows? Some activist investor gets his knickers in a twist and the whole business model changes.
I know you get stars in your eyes over tech, but let's get real. You can't ever trust a corporation to do the right thing for consumers. Ever.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
If the service goes away, so what? Sign up with another.
If the streaming business model changes to your dissatisfaction, just stop paying for it.
You can stream. You can still have your physical CDs. You can still have your LPs. No one is suggesting that you have abandon one to have the other.
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I own a lot of books you won't find in any public library. Don't think this helps your case
This is the invisible elephant in the room that no one wants to discuss.
And yet another reason why I'm not giving up my CDs.
If you entrust your data - be it personal music, personal data, or corporate data - to ANY 3rd party, you do NOT control what happens to it.
If you use a 3rd party music provider, you have no assurance of ANYTHING.
I rented a car for a week, and there was a small sticker on it, in an
out-of-the-way location, which advised that the car was delivering all
manner of data back to the manufacturer on a constant basis.
We are being watched and monitored all the time and everywhere. You can't
stop it, but you can reduce it. You should do so.
Life is hard. It's harder when you're stupid.
"This is the invisible elephant in the room that no one wants to discuss.
And yet another reason why I'm not giving up my CDs."You are incredibly misinformed and don't understand when people say "They have gotten rid of their CDs" - They have merely transferred their physical Media from a cheap plastic disk that is prone to scratches to a much more secure and scratch free physical Media.
Yes, I gave away my Cheap Plastic Disks, but I have over 5,000 Albums that are scratch free. Secure from theft, as I have a copy in my Safe Deposit box. Much more secure than your Music Library. And if I wanted a copy of the music on a Cheap Plastic Disk, I could Burn an exact Copy for you.
That is the only 'Elephant in the Room'. -- Not sure how many times, we have to explain this to the misinformed.
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I'm a minority of one. When I was still working, nobody I worked with still had physical music collections.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
I'm quite sure the people that you worked with still had Physical Music Collections. They most likely copied their CD Files to a Thumb Drive, Hard Drive or SSD before they gave the 'Bulky' CD Files away.But they still have a 'Physical' Music Collection. It may reside on a Ceramic, Glass or Metal Disk on a Hard Drive instead of Cheap Plastic Disk that you stick into a CD Player. The main advantage of this 'Physical Storage' is that I can take my entire 5,000 Album Physical Music Library and put it in my Shirt Pocket. I take it with me, when I'm traveling for the winter.
And if they want they can copy the Hard Drive File back to a Cheap Plastic File and stick it in a CD Player.
I've worked in software my entire working life (30 Years) - So, I may take for granted what people know and think is a 'Physical Music Collection' -- So, there is your detailed explanation. Here is my entire 5,000+ Album Music Library and it is as 'Physical' as any Music Library Collection.... Just takes up less space.
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Some people think all cable sounds the same...... And some people think "resolution is resolution," regardless of whether it's from physical discs or file storage......
Meanwhile, I think the differences in sound between physical media and stored/streamed files is noticeable enough to where I believe I'd pass an ABX test with this. Especially if the stored/streamed files are "lossless" and decoded in real time.
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You mean wire isn't wire? And resolution isn't resolution? Don't make any bets if you do a blind test.
There is a cable link, between the MC step up transformer and phono stage, which I believe I would pass an ABX test as well..... Although I'm not so sure for other cable runs in the system. (I hear differences elsewhere, but likely not enough to pass an ABX.)
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Could be. It is possible to make cables that color the sound. And given that the signal from a cartridge is so low to begin with and sensitive to loading I wouldn't be surprised if you could pick out some cables that are acting like a passive equalizers or picking up a little audible noise. But if we are talking hi res digital I recommend you don't make any wagers.
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What is the audio signal in cables and why is it affected by vibration, RFI, geometry, type of metal, purity of metal, gauge of metal, dielectric material, and direction. Hel-loo!The more things change the more they stay the same.
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They didn't keep any of the files around, they build and share playlists in Spotify and that's what they listen to.
You and I back our stuff up. I still have thousands of LPs archived on external drives. A lot of stuff ripped for CD as well.
But Joe Public doesn't even run software updates. They rely on cloud storage and streaming for their music.
And if I've got the LP, what the hell do I need any other format for? I don't listen to music in the car, don't even turn on the radio. Even my old iPod Classic sits and gathers dust.
To me, it looks like a choice between having a record collection that I own or trusting my music to multinational conglomerates. And we all know just how trustworthy multinational conglomerates are.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
nt
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"You are incredibly misinformed"
You are incredibly insulting. Why can't you make an argument without making these kinds of pedantic personal attacks? Honestly, is this some sort of social disorder you suffer from?
"and don't understand when people say "They have gotten rid of their CDs" - They have merely transferred their physical Media from a cheap plastic disk that is prone to scratches to a much more secure and scratch free physical Media."
You are making that up. "When people say" there is no reason to change the meaning fo what they say. If someone tells me they "got rid of their CDs" that means they got rid of their CDs. You don't speak for "people" I assure you, you are not like other people.
"Yes, I gave away my Cheap Plastic Disks, but I have over 5,000 Albums that are scratch free. Secure from theft, as I have a copy in my Safe Deposit box. Much more secure than your Music Library. And if wanted a copy of the music on a Cheap Plastic Disk, we could all Burn an exact Copy for you."
You live in your own world bro. 5,000 albums in a "safe deposit box?" Do you have any pictures? What bank has safe deposit boxes that can safely hold 5,000 LPs? And what does that cost? Asking for a friend who is really paranoid about their collection of 5,000 LPs and would like the same level of protection. And even if this is true, which I kind of doubt...it's absurd and has virtually no connection to normal real world life.
"That is the only 'Elephant in the Room'. -- Not sure how many times, we have to explain this to the misinformed."
"We?" You are on your own here. And your continued rudeness is the only thing anyone will take away from your post. Not sure how many times we will have to explain basic manners to you.
I believe Cut-Throat was referring to the fact that he ripped his CD collection and saved it to an external drive. Here's the one I keep at home on a small USB drive. As of today, it has 5,847 albums with 61,659 songs by 13,224 artists (along with many other files) and would easily fit in a safe deposit box. (Stats courtesy of LMS.) It is one of several backups I keep.
His main point is that having one or more backups of a LP or CD collection is simply not practical.
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That's exactly how I interpreted his post.
And I don't GAS whether anyone streams, or listens to music HOWEVER they choose to.
The whole argument is just another reason for "audiophiles" to bicker and choose a
side to take while the PTB (music sellers) cash in on the the latest way to sell music
to us and we pursue the new(est) avenues to do so. Or don't. I don't stream music.
Really, if we all can listen to what we like, how we like, when we like the brouhaha about
it all is mostly unnecessary bullshit and typical consternation by the financially comfortable.
"Once this was all Black Plasma and Imagination" -Michael McClure
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Could be that was what he meant. hard to tell. *If* that was what he meant then either doesn't understand the concept of owning physical media much less why some of us like owning physical media or he simply rejects other peoples' points of view. Ironic given his attempt to speak for other people in his post. Either way he could make his points without being such a dick about it. A little more clarity would help too. Calling digital files physical media is just playing Humpty Dumpty and making words mean what he personally wants them to mean. Kills communication.
the abject ignorance over this topic either.
NT
I listen almost exclusively to classical and if I find a particular performance that I really like i'll buy the CD. That's seemingly rare any more, I think I've bought maybe 5 this past year. I did buy a couple of VERY expensive blueray collections of live performances because they were superlative performances and I wanted to listen to them through the main system, not just the computer or TV speakers. I have one performance of a Mahler 2 that is only available on Youtube, it's from a BBC Proms concert. It was so compelling, both audio and video, that I took a long time figuring out how to to copy it to the computer, burn it to a DVD and a CD. It's a performance that I would feel miss greatly if I didn't have access to it every so often. While it's still there on YT, I know that eventually the DRM folks will strip it away and it will be lost to the world, since the BBC has yet to issue it on a DVD for sale.I got started in LP's late, so my record collection is small. I have a VERY expensive turntable/arm/cartridge (SME 20/2A, SME iv.vi, Koetsu Black) that sits gathering dust. My source for records (dealer who sold me the TT) retired and moved away. I shouldn't have spent so much on the system considering my late start, but it sounded so good I couldn't pass it up. A bit after I bought it the price doubled overnight on it, so at least I got it before that. I keep thinking that someday I'll set it back up, but truth be told streaming and CD's are so much easier for a classical music listener. Getting up to flip the record 6 times listening to a Mahler symphony or a Mozart opera is a literal pain for me.
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about. Sheesh! --- I know of no one that has not been able to find a 'tune'.
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Unless somebody kicks down my door and takes them, they're mine.
Mine, I tell you.
BTW, there have been disputes between artists and content providers which have resulted in the artists pulling their music.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
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which have resulted in the artists pulling their music.
streaming services, yes.
Not attempting to hack into my network to delete purchased content. Paranoia is you.
Remember when Microsoft terminated its e-book system? You bought a book from MS, you lost it when the service ended.
No refund required, though MS did offer $25 credit towards any of its other products.
Problems with Apple and Music (replacement for iTunes) are voluminous.
Why put up with all that bullshit for just a little bit of convenience?
When I put up my money for music, I want to own it, not borrow it. The DRM Act needs major revisions. Give consumers some rights, I'll ditch my own physical collection.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
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You continue to talk about internet based streaming service challenges - and I acknowledge that content is subject to change.
The notion that Amazon, Bandcamp, CD Universe, HD Tracks, Qobuz, Presto Classical, and host of other music download services will *attempt* to hack into your network and delete that which you've legally purchased from them, however, is simply crazy.
Obviously, you have zero experience in that matter. The only bullshit is coming from your paranoia.
Once it's downloaded, either music or e-books or whatever, no one is going to take it off of your laptop/network.
Jack
> > Once it's downloaded, either music or e-books or whatever, no one is going
> > to take it off of your laptop/network.
Not true with ebooks. There was an Amazon Kindle incident a few years back in which they removed purchased copies of George Owell's 1984 novel from users' Kindles. It was a complicated situation. A book seller had uploaded electronic copies of the book without permission from the real copyright owner. That's what triggered Amazon's action -- they removed the copies and refunded the purchase.
With streaming services, you don't "download" a copy of the music, it simply plays in real time, and when the song finishes, there is nothing on your computer or streamer to remove.
If you actually buy a copy of the file and download, you're free to back it up and keep an offline copy that no one can get to unless they gain physical access to your home.
I would think not.
My concern would be losing data. Hard drives fail. files on hard drives get corrupted from time to time or even accidentally erased. Shit does happen. Preserving digital data is a real world issue. Of course it does have solutions. But the idea that the fear of losing digital data is just a phobia is a bit off the mark and insulting to Old dude. If you do lose a download and there is no replacement available from the original merchant you are SOL.
Let's not forget, we live in an era of disposable digital hardware. No one keeps the same CPU for 20-30 years. Things fall through the cracks if one is not careful with their data and their data transfers when chaning hardware. And yes, I have heard of the cloud....
I want something to KEEP for my money - others don't seem to care which is their choice. I just don't like it when they slime those that don't do the streaming thing.
I stream into the toilet and then flush
It's not there to protect artists or the public.
The sad tale of Microsoft's e-book business and the number of people whining right now about their favorite show getting dropped from HBO+ should be a lesson.
The blissful counterstroke-a considerable new message.
they're doing what was done to artists (Fogerty - classic example)
start small with the big tease then suck the profits in
If we are talking about vinyl vs. commercial downloads your example is a great example of unique variables. Vinyl playback is always colored. That is what makes it both subjectively better and subjectively worse depending on the listener. The vinyl playback gear has it's own sets of colorations. And as audiophiles we can choose our favorite flavors of vinyl playback through choosing gear that avoids some colorations but includes colorations we like. You are not going to get that from a download.Let's look at your example of AP's Kind of Blue. It's a great example of another kind of variable. That is a reissue of the Classics 45 rpm. That particular record was cut by Bernie Grundman directly from the original three track recording and mixed on the fly. There literally is no digital copy of that. Downloads, at least hi res downloads should be audibly tranaparent copies of the signal from which they were made. But there is lies the rub. What was the signal? What was the mastering if there was any?
Bottom line is there are always going to be differences in sound between the two media and often between the source signals from which they are derived.
Which is better is subjective.
Personally I don'tsee it as an either/or proposition.
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Assuming you set up a decent digital system the sound quality from downloads and streaming should be as good as your LPs. But don't expect them to sound exactly the same. If you prefer the typical 'warmth' of LPs I wouldn't expect downloads or streaming to sound like that.
I gave away all of my CDs and most of LPs about a year ago and have no regrets.
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Until improvements cease to exist it is a moving target for the wealthy. For those of us with lesser incomes, generally speaking, analog will be easier on the ear, digital rules the spec world.
"Until improvements cease to exist it is a moving target for the wealthy."What the hell does that mean?
A streaming setup will often cost less than a good analog setup (TT, cartridge, phono preamp, etc.). And services themselves are around $5.00 to $15.00 / mo for high quality lossless audio. I pay more than that per month to wipe my ass with cheap toilet paper.
Edits: 09/10/22
My dyslexia strikes again...... I initially read the title of the post as "Moving magnet for the wealthy"..... And wondered why it didn't make sense..............
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It means the best gear in both are constantly being bettered. Regardless of how good they are today, they will be better tomorrow. Only the rich can keep up, dumping last years best for this years best. Who's ahead at the moment? It may change over time. When it becomes static the high end truly will die. That's what the Hell it means. If that sounds a bit abrasive, posturing and disrespectful please take a good look in the mirror. Your asswipe reference speaks for itself.
Nonsense gibberish!"It means the best gear in both are constantly being bettered. Regardless of how good they are today, they will be better tomorrow. Only the rich can keep up, dumping last years best for this years best. Who's ahead at the moment? It may change over time. When it becomes static the high end truly will die. That's what the Hell it means."
I'm surprised you own a computer to post your message. You know they're getting better and cheaper everyday.
Wait on the sidelines and do nothing? That's a good approach for someone who wants to enjoy music from a streaming service sometime before he dies.
"Your asswipe reference speaks for itself."
Yes it does! It drives the point home that the price of entry for streaming is dirt cheap. Cheaper than toilet paper. Are you waiting for further improvements and even lower prices before you buy your next roll of toilet paper?
Edits: 09/11/22
Claiming gibberish, being rude and manufacturing things never saiid is your style I guess. Good luck with that.
Sorry if you consider heated debate to be rude. I guess I could tone it down some but my examples were to drive the point home about:
- Pulling the trigger at some point to experience music streaming. You can stand on the sidelines forever and never experience anything new.
- And consuming music from a streaming service is cheaper than toilet paper on a monthly basis. Unless you're really full of _ _ _ _ I suppose.
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Insult and ridicule are not debate. Feigning innocence of rudeness is not honesty. Extrapolating false assumptions as support is deliberate spin. You are quite transparent and not sorry at all. You're a sniper, you enjoy it, you're an argument looking for a reason and rocking people back on their heels and pummeling them is your idea of fun. Take a good look in the mirror.
Debates in online forums are not for the faint of heart. I sincerely apologize if you feel attacked and offended.
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I'll take your back handed apology and raise you my back handed acceptance. Please don't respond to any posts by me. Including this one. Thank you.
If your post is in a thread that I am also participating in, you may get a response from me. It's up to you if you want to ignore it.
It wasn't a backhanded apology. I'm sorry and I'll do better next time.
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Belligerent sincerity. What a concept.
I looked back at this thread and I don't see any attacks on you personally, yet I apologized. Yes, it was heated but heated debate is nothing new to online forums.
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My bad for considering aggressive insult, ridicule, abrasiveness and rudeness as attacks. Your chance for sincere apology was at my second post. Later, I presented an off-ramp when I asked you to please not respond to my posts. All you had to do was...-. Nothing. Just let it go. You couldn't. Don't play the innocent card. Neither will I. At this point the winner is the biggest dick. Let's just agree to ignore each other. If that's not good enough for you then...- you win.
I'm not asking for anything so this isn't about me. It's about your hurt feelings. There's a link titled "Alert Moderator" if you feel so inclined. That's what it's there for.
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Your interest may vary but the results will be same. (Byrd 2020)
I can't compete with the dead. (Buck W. 2010)
Cowards can't be heroes. (Byrd 2017)
Why don't catfish have kittens? (Moe Howard 1937)
Good TP, it's worth every nickel (no such thing as a penny for 10 years here, saying has to match). :)
It's been that way for me for years now....
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nt
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