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A bit more on Herbie da Great.I think HvK's greatest achievement was to somehow drag out his own 'OOZLUM bird event' for several decades!
Despite that it quickly became evident that that was what it was.
I kinda feel it started in the late '60's.
Yet some of his acolytes want to infinitely postpone that ultimate fwoop! When even they would have to face up to what's been going on, even though he's already mouldering.
And I am pretty certain I heard the final 'fwooP!' well before that.
But I wasn't really focussed on Herbie at that time, maybe I imagined it. ;-)}
OR
Maybe I was just as self absorbed at the time, too. ;-)}
Timbo
Follow Ups:
c
r
Yes, it's just that the unevenness was unacknowledged by himself and far too many others. Still is.And I became bored with people telling me that Karajan was 'the greatest', from the late 1960's onwards.
Fwoop was indeed the problem, just IMO.
BTW Australians are rather more alert to this particular trait and tend to be particulary irrittaed by it. AKA the critique ranges from 'being a bit up himself' through to 'Fwoop', Geddit!
I have a few HVK rcords which I treasure, EMI's Brain Mozart Horn Conc's eg, and Deccas, and some 1960's DGG LvB stuff. I think the DGG box of the Strauss tone poems is excellent - for another example.
I stopped buying HvK quite soon, in the late 1970's, and I can cope with that. Budget went on more Jazz, Popular etc and on choral, and the 18th C and HIP.
Timbo
...she's one of my all-time favorites, but I often feel she ought to have retired about 5 years sooner than she actually did.Since both of you (Timbo and Dame Joan) are Australian, do you have any thoughts on this (assuming you are/were into opera)?
djprobed
A half Aussie, I feel more than competent to answer that question.Before she became a Knight of the Realm, Sutherland was an eager and gifted young soprano of outstanding natural voice and agility. She generally eshewed consonants, which great facilitated her legato. No actress on stage, she was often unfairly compared with Callas' histrionics, but further study reveals good vocal acting abilities (her first Violetta comes to mind). I also hold her Donizetti in high esteem.
Early is best with Dame Joan, but there is plenty to enjoy and if you're no singer (or student of voice with an agenda and nits to pick) you can get a lot out of her work.
Big B
Umm Opera, Mozart yes, Haydn lately, some of Verdi and Giacomo R. but no not much. Handel and Gluck, Lully, Montiverdi, Rameau, Purcell, yumm yumm , YUM!Joan was a lovely person and had a lovely sound, I met her once when I was still a 'boy chorister', I had just sung a difficult solo and she was very sweet to me. More?
The Don Giovanni I have is the EMI one with a young clear Joan.
5 years. She should have stopped even earlier IMO. But that is not an uncommon view :-)}.
OTOH I cherish a simulcast she did, well into this time, of Die Flederamaus which was a delicious ripplingly funny riot. Mainly due to her and the other lass.
I particulary liked her singing early on, 'cos she didn't overuse vibrato in the standard works. I frankly think that Bel Canto was not a particularly good direction for her voice, but it did the Bonynges as a couple a lot of good.
Then again Vibrato was 'severely eschewed' in Anglican* Churches back then thanks to the RSCM. *aka Episcopalian. AND I find the plots and characters of most Bel Canto operas even less believable than those of of standard works whixh also suffer from this.
AND the music?! For elaborateness I prefer Baroque music and operas. Maybe I am just an old Protestant / Puritan.
Timbo
Dude!What have you been smoking?
Who the hog is Herbie?For god's sake man, speak the queen's english.
T2
"Music is life, and life is music"
HvK
= Herbet von Karajan, common term Herbie around here.do a search.
Timbo
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