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On October 9th 2005 You wrote:> > As I've said, I only review on request, and only on review samples. You noticed, I have not posted reviews on any of the players that I own. . . < <
But you do own the DVD-S97. Well since you've done a policy u-turn, could you now post a graph of the frequency response of DVD-A with the DVD-S97's DPLII function engaged? ;-)
Actually, it's not a policy u-turn. I did say "I only review on request, and only on review samples", so obviously at least one of those events have occured.Also, I have to disclose I am now getting paid for my reviews (hence the "R" next to my moniker).
> > I did say "I only review on request, and only on review samples", so obviously at least one of those events have occured. < <But in that case you should have said "or". But since you used the word "and", then logically, both conditions should have been met (not just one).
Anyway, how about the freq response in the scenario I outlined.
No, "and" is correct for this particular instance.As for the freq response, how much are you willing to pay me to satisfy your curiosity? :-) And what would that prove (since the Panasonic, like nearly all digital players, applies a low pass filter with a cut off at 20 kHz even for 96 kHz signals without Dolby Pro Logic II decoding) If the slope of the filter changes, that could be a "feature" of the implementation and does not disclose what resolution may have been used in the decoding process.
> > No, "and" is correct for this particular instance. < <Not if one either adheres to the rules of English grammar OR Boolean logic. ;-)
> > As for the freq response, how much are you willing to pay me to satisfy your curiosity? :-) < <Ahem. That should have been covered in your review.
> > and what would that prove (since the Panasonic, like nearly all digital players, applies a low pass filter with a cut off at 20 kHz even for 96 kHz signals < <
That's news to me. In which case, your player’s purported "hirez" credentials are a con.
And I'm so glad my player is not one of those! I've seen Paul Miller's plots for the Denon DVD-A11, it's flat all the way out to the Nyquist limits of the sample rate in use. (Even with the Sharc DSP & BM engaged).
. . . > > If the slope of the filter changes, that could be a "feature" of the implementation and does not disclose what resolution may have been used in the decoding process. < <Nice get-out Christine! :-)
*** Not if one either adheres to the rules of English grammar OR Boolean logic. ;-) ***No, you don't understand. I stated two conditions by which I will review a product. Both those conditions were upheld for this particular instance (at least in spirit - I can explain further, but it would need to be by private email).
*** That should have been covered in your review. ***
Why? It's not in the review template, which I have to adhere to. The review template never asked me to measure the frequency response of Dolby Pro Logic decoding, so I didn't.
*** I've seen Paul Miller's plots for the Denon DVD-A11, it's flat all the way out to the Nyquist limits of the sample rate in use. ***
Can you provide a link to this?
*** Nice get-out Christine! :-) ***
No, I was simply telling the truth. It works both ways. For example, even if the frequency response extended to beyond 20 kHz, it does not necessarily mean the processing was done at greater than 48 kHz. For example, some filtering algorithms deliberately introduce ultrasonic noise beyond Nyquist - read the Cirrus Logic paper on this. And the Panasonic has a "slow" filter implementation, which means it is capable of this.
But I wouldn't be surprised if a Dolby Pro Logic II implementation implements a 20kHz filter even at high resolution. If you recall, the original Dolby Pro Logic algorithm filters the rear channels down to 12 kHz because they interfere with the steering logic. Dolby literature states that PLII is transparent to 20kHz, but they never imply there is no filtering beyond 20kHz.
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Nice review!Did you fool with PCM digital output at all? In another thread, a forum member said that Panasonic stated that this unit doesn't choke the PCM output of DVD-A discs that aren't copy protected and will transmit full 24/192 data. Any chance that you were able to verify this?
It's a shame you couldn't review the unit with HDMI. It becomes a completely different unit. It does a much better job at scaling to widescreen TVs. The picture is more film like, and darker, sort of like comparing the first couple of seasons of MASH with the last couple of seasons. Where on HDMI it looks like the earlier seasons.Audio is all upsampled 2-4X until 96Khz. I think many red book CDs sound as good as DVD-A and SACD via analog. In fact if the disk is a 2 channel hybrid I’ll play the CD layer on the 97 vs. the DSD layer on the Pioneer 563. If it’s MCH I’ll use the 563.
As for playing various disks the 97 fails on those crappy home burned downloaded music disks that my kids and their friends like. Unfortunately the 563 is successful. However I have a few HDCDs and they sound great on the 97!!
Can players not implement "peak extend" and still use the HDCD logo? How do you detect that reliably?I am evaluating a Yamaha S657 and although it has no HDCD logo, when a HDCD is played, it shows HDCD on the TV screen! While playing Reference Recording Sampler 2 on the last track which uses peak extend, there is a noticable drop in volume 1 sec after the track starts, possibly when the decoder kicks in. The previous track is the same recording without HDCD & there is no such problem.
Any ideas anybody? How can I confirm if this player really decodes HDCD because it has no HDCD logo or patent warnings? It seems to be based on Philips 720SA. Maybe the base player plays all discs but can be disabled to reduce costs? For example the Philips 720SA does not play DVD-A but the Yamaha plays it! So it detects HDCD, but since Yamaha did not pay for HDCD, it wrongly attenuates the volume to compensate for the peak extend which never got decoded? (Some HDCD players seem to reduce the volume on HDCD so as to not clip)
Ask Yamaha? nt
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