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Re: Do the math...

195.86.126.19

Posted by Frank.. on June 14, 2004 at 04:46:40

In Reply to: Re: Do the math... posted by Christine Tham on June 14, 2004 at 03:31:44:

***Yes it is - I have the ability to zoom in to any precision in Cool Edit - far more precise than looking at statistics.***

With cubase the wave representation in generated into a seperate file for performance reasons. This is only a crude wav representation where samples are simply 'decimated'. If you have 1 sec of wav on your screen then you have only 90..120 pixels to represent 96000 samples.

I'm not shure about cooledit or adobe audition. I did play with AA a couple of months ago but didn't look into this.

In any case the vertical resolution you can view is limited by your vertical pixel resolution on your screen.

***You are still confusing relative dynamics with dynamic range. They are NOT proportional to each other. relative dynamics is the difference in dB between any two points in a waveform. Dynamic range is the difference between the loudest signal and the noise floor.***

It really is of no consequense the difference between the loudest and the softest sample is proportional to the difference between any sample.

***Instead of arguing the point, why don't you do your own experiments and prove me wrong? All it takes is US$30 for the SACD and DVD-A, a US$100 soundcard and a universal player. You can download a trial edition of Adobe Audition, or Sound Forge but as I recall you already have Cubase.***

Perhaps I do, but I'm not that interrested in purchasing any more Diana Krall discs.

***Remember my assertion - any relatively "loud" point in the SACD recording is comparitively louder than the DVD-A in comparison to any relatively "soft" point in any part of the entire recording. Just don't select a soft point less than -60dB or so or you'll run into DSD ultrasonic noise.

The differences in relative dynamics between any two points can be up to 1-1.5dB - audibly significant.***

Which might be caused by the dsd noise.
Remember that it is possible to have the higher sample + dsd (peak)noise and the lower sample - dsd (peak)noise.
Remember that a 1.5dB difference at the lower end of the scale only represents a minute voltage change.

You can't this measure with a linear rular.

***Remember from digital sampling theory what i've empirically measured is actually possible. Remember that the analog reconstruction can have peaks higher than the highest digital sample. So it follows that different sampling rates can give rise to different reconstructions, which differ in relative dynamics.***

The sample rate isn't of any consequence for the reconstruction method. Only the parameters, such as the filters corner frequency , changes.

***One point of note: I am *not* saying the SACD recording is "better" than DVD-A, merely that it exhibits higher relative dynamics. It could well be that the DVD-A recording is accurately reflecting the "true" dynamics and the SACD is "exaggerating" dynamics. For example Dolby Digital exaggerates transients - that's why Dolby Digital always sound "punchy" in comparison to PCM.

I see too much variables that prevent any sound conclusion about dynamics. Measuring beteen pcm samples is indeed very dubious because as you indicated, the reconstructed waves amplitude differs from the samples amplitude.

Frank

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