In Reply to: depending on what "superior" refer to and what format you compare with..yes it is... posted by NonA on April 25, 2004 at 08:36:27:
If you look at the DVD Audio Standard there can be bit depths of 12, 16, 20, and 24. Sample rates can be 44.1, 48, 88.2, 96, 172.4, and 192.
If you research DVD audio discs that are out, many are 24/44.1 or 24/48 which isn't a whole lot different than standard CD. It is not until you get into the high sample rates 96 and up that DVD audio really distances itself from redbook CD and there is not a lot of recordings available with these resolutions. Studios who have been making 16/44.1 CD's for years do not have the equipment to do 24/192 any more than they have the equipment to do DSD. To do either of the new formats correctly takes a significant investment in new hardware.Unfortunatly many SACD's are just DSD conversion of the same low res PCM recordings and since you cannot create data that was not there in the first place. These are no better than the PCM that was started with. Pure DSD recordings are by definition high sample rate and are more widely available than 24/192 DVD Audio Discs. Yes it is true, DSD signals need to be sampled to multibit for DSP, but a DSD capable workstation does this at a very high sample rate. Again, this is also required for high sample rate LPCM, but not by definition DVD Audio which does not need to be higher bit or sample rate than Redbook.
The comment about SACD noise causing damage to amps is just a ruse to spread Fear Uncertainty and Doubt. Reality is that the max noise level I have seen in any of Stereophile's test's is -40db. While when testing Amps, Stereophile has been measuring amplifier frequency response out to 200khz with a high level signal for years. Stereophile is not having amps blowing up left and right in this test are they. It is just not an issue.
From a marketing standpoint both DVD Audio and SACD are not about bringing hi res to the masses, it is about bringing out multichannel and yes it is about royality revenue. The big corporations do not care about about a few audiophiles or they would not keep turning up the level of CD's until there is no dynamic range left. Do we want to bring up the fact that DVD Audio was delayed for YEARS as these corporations argued about what Watermarking Technology to use? Talk about screwing something up!
The only area where from a Technology standpoint that SACD does not meet CD is about 10db higher noise floor at 20khz. There is not a system out there where you can tell the differnence between a -90db and a -100db noise floor so this point is irrelevant.
From a listening stand point, I can't tell the difference between the SACD which started from a DSD recording and PCM which started from a 24/96 or higher recording. I can tell the difference between the above and 24/44.1 and 24/48 which at this time make up a lot of the DVD Audio Titles available.
Cheers
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Follow Ups
- Some of your statements are a little misleading - vettracer 18:19:33 04/26/04 (38)
- what i would stress out ... - NonA 06:36:56 04/27/04 (0)
- Unfortunately so are some of yours ... - Christine Tham 21:07:33 04/26/04 (36)
- ahhh the arrogance :-)... i know you fancy yourself as some sort of Guru... - NonA 07:00:04 04/27/04 (35)
- Re: ahhh the arrogance :-)... i know you fancy yourself as some sort of Guru... - robert young 19:56:08 04/29/04 (0)
- Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 13:57:39 04/27/04 (31)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - andy_c 21:43:12 04/27/04 (4)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 23:07:00 04/27/04 (3)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - andy_c 20:14:41 04/28/04 (2)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 20:27:20 04/28/04 (1)
- with the proper signal conditioning... - NonA 07:39:18 04/29/04 (0)
- I would stop reading Pyramix and Meitner propaganda... - NonA 16:35:18 04/27/04 (2)
- your response is a perfect example of why i didn't bother to post in the first place :-) (nt) - Christine Tham 16:39:03 04/27/04 (1)
- I think you're confused....nt - NonA 17:52:25 04/27/04 (0)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Frank. 15:04:20 04/27/04 (14)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 16:33:12 04/27/04 (13)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Frank. 01:14:02 04/28/04 (11)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 02:56:08 04/28/04 (10)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Frank. 03:28:25 04/28/04 (9)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 03:42:34 04/28/04 (8)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Frank 05:04:06 04/28/04 (7)
- incidentally, if you ever do record a live symphony orchestra ... - Christine Tham 14:59:35 04/28/04 (0)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Christine Tham 13:48:17 04/28/04 (0)
- You're right, she sounds like some inexperienced low level technician.... - NonA 06:43:50 04/28/04 (4)
- above post is mere vituperation of no substantive value (NT) - tunenut 11:22:13 04/28/04 (3)
- as opposed to your lab dog bark anytime you feel the need to defend your ilk... - NonA 11:46:37 04/28/04 (2)
- ditto (NT) - tunenut 13:34:48 04/28/04 (1)
- WOOF! :-) nt - NonA 07:41:53 04/29/04 (0)
- "....if you can predict what the loudest part of the signal will be. in a real life situation, you often can't..." wrong - NonA 17:10:15 04/27/04 (0)
- Re: Actually, no, i don't consider myself a Guru at all ... - Frank 14:40:32 04/27/04 (7)
- yes it does - Christine Tham 16:08:45 04/27/04 (6)
- Re: yes it does - Frank. 00:27:33 04/28/04 (5)
- Re: yes it does - Christine Tham 13:49:12 04/28/04 (4)
- Re: yes it does - Frank. 05:24:03 04/29/04 (3)
- Re: yes it does - Christine Tham 13:39:29 04/29/04 (2)
- Ted's reply proofes nothing. - Frank. 03:00:37 04/30/04 (1)
- Re: Ted's reply proofes nothing. - Christine Tham 16:58:57 04/30/04 (0)
- ironic... - tunenut 10:00:37 04/27/04 (1)
- I see you got the point (about the arrogance)...maybe she will... - NonA 10:23:14 04/27/04 (0)