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174.69.113.98
Could this be it?
. . . in theory, practice and theory are the same; in practice, they are different . . .
Follow Ups:
Bluesound is looking better and better. Still, SB was the bargain of the first decade.
Do any of today's WiFi equipped Smart TVs pass along 24hz/96khz via their digital outs? My Panasonic 60ST60 brings it in great from my office desktop computer via Media Center server. The problem is it won't pass along Hi Rez to the NAD receiver.
I have the Bluesound node. With the recent addition of spotify it does everything I need it to do.
Sound is better than SB Touch, it sounds clearer to my ears, I also have the SB Touch in a second system.
Bluesound is a no fuss player, plays high res and for what it is worth does the job for me.
Just to clarify anything I may have said about the SBT: I was assuming people just use it as a "terminal". IOW they don't use the built-in display or DAC or accompanying remote/PS etc.
So I'm only comparing it to other player-boxes that don't even have a DAC/display/smart remote and assume you provide that to taste. That is the SBT world I've been in for some years so I sometimes forget there's another SBT world of people using the device pretty much as-is. That wouldn't be good enough for me either.
"I sometimes forget there's another SBT world of people using the device pretty much as-is. That wouldn't be good enough for me either."
I wonder what vintage SBT you had. I bought one and wasn't satisfied with the sound and returned it. Later I decide to tackle it as a project (rather than as a solution) and bought another just before the availability got bad.
When I listened to it as a baseline before ripping into it I found that it actually sounded very good. An inmate said that they had gone to another DAC or something and apparently whatever it was did the trick. I have been using it pure stock ever since to listen to streaming audio and am very happy. For a while my local station had an improved stream, maybe 320K AAC or something like that and it was just beautiful using the internal DAC. With 128K streams I suspect the SBT is not having much sonic impact...
Rick
I didn't know they changed anything, Logitech generally seems very unwilling to do that in an existing model, usually change = new model/device. IOW I don't know what "version" I have. :)When I said "not good enough", I just meant not close enough to my CDP into the same external DAC to "replace" it for more attentive listening, though via S/PDIF for the SBT vs the CDP's AES/EBU. Attaining closeness was my goal.
I later came to the conclusion through lots of screwing around that it's the AES/EBU interface with this particular DAC that's giving me the little bit "better" with the CDP, so I settled down and admitted the SBT as a source was pretty good. And I use it waaay more than the CDP, but the CDP has much more sonic flexibility due to its various interfaces and even its analog output is pretty decent.
So it's not like the SBT replaced anything, it's a convenient option and I hate to say that I seem to be choosing convenience a lot more these days than I used to...
Edit: as to if the "cloud"/remote server went away, it wouldn't affect my main/most important SBT use much AFAIK. I would only lose my external streaming capability, and not my internal (home) ability, right??
As to the external streaming, I think there are probably enough plugins (that I don't use now) to cover the few sources I do use. Being in Canada, half (or more) of the decent stuff is already unavailable to me without some jiggery-poke to spoof my location and payment.
Edits: 08/23/14
"it's [an SBT] a convenient option and I hate to say that I seem to be choosing convenience a lot more these days than I used to..."
That's simply a sign of maturity and honed judgement!
"So it's not like the SBT replaced anything"
Oh no, of course not, it's an addition, an enhancement to one's system. I still have three players and a DAC in mine. The main thing I wanted in the short term was streaming audio with no fan and that latter clause eliminates almost everything in the way of GP computers.
I do have a bunch of records and tapes I'd like to hear again someday but digital media is so painless compared to the LP's that I may never 'rip' them.
Regards, Rick
Exactly my state: should I or shouldn't I rip my LPs? I've been following Abe's comments about how he did his.
So far, I have mostly been taking the easy way out and buying as many as possible on the best CDs I can find (almost all from the UK/Europe). i.e. throwing money at the problem.
I think that "editing" the digitized LP tracks, whatever needs to be done including tagging, would try my patience [see "convenience" :)]. You see, the vast majority of my LPs are Canadian pressings, and the ones that aren't are mostly rather obscure titles, and like for just about all my Canadian-version CDs, they don't match up with what's in the online databases. Luckily I don't have that many of those CDs, but the less-fussy online DB I used to use is no longer in operation, and the ones that are are much more particular about "matching" i.e. you get all or nothing, no fuzzy logic.
It is no real effort to throw on an LP. I still do it regulalrly. After the SBT just getting off my ass seems like a real inconvenience...
I messed around with the logitech unofficial plugin which allows USB audio output, I have that into a Yaqin DAC and it sounds really good.
Understanding that the power supply and no screen and shutting off the wifi make a huge difference, it is very good. Maybe it is time to sell mine as it will be useless for me when their cloud shuts down.
"Maybe it is time to sell mine as it will be useless for me when their cloud shuts down."
I'm concerned about that too. I bought an RPi to use as a local server but haven't finished the project since there hasn't been much need. But like you I figure it's just a matter of time. While I'm enjoying the device I think that the advantages of the thin client paradigm are long gone yet the liabilities linger. Fortunately their server has only been down once for any significant time since I've been using it.
I pretty-much only listen to classical music from public radio sources so I don't need an intermediary service which may be the main remaining advantage of their topology.
I REALLY like the convenience of local control and haven't noticed any sonic improvement turning off the display. Maybe that's not sufficient? Unfortunately the volume control does seem to degrade the sound which is a bummer as I could use it since I'm not currently using my remote control preamp. I've already used it enough to way amortize it's cost so whatever happens in the future I've no regrets...
Rick
I also use the SBT with separate power supply, Separate DAC, the Screen does not run... etc.
It is really LMS that makes the SBT Special also the guys that are writing special Pluggins for the SBT.
Cut-Throat
That sounds crazy to me. Get an embedded Linux solution then. $500 mobo Linux kernal custom compiled and there you go. I don't know why you would waste money and time trying to improve SBT. There are much better ways to go about it than tinkering with a toy.
nt
Cut-Throat
they no longer make it! I'm afraid once mysqueezebox.com goes down it'll be useless for me. I don't have the resources to run a perl script 24/7 so I guess I will have to sell it before it becomes a paperweight.
nt
Cut-Throat
Bluesound is closer to anything I've seen to the SBT. Does not have an app that runs on a PC...just a mobile app.
Still for the $450 that the bluesound costs, you can still get a SBT on E-bay. Maybe even new sealed in Box. But easily a used or refurbed one. That would be my choice.
Cut-Throat
Agreed! If my SB Classic 3 would stream 24/96 I'd use that with the NAD's DACS. The Classic does still sound good with standard rez.
a) no Wi-Fi
b) no display
c) roughly 5 times the price of SB Touch
d) did not bother to read more detail about functionality after a to c
Thanks, but no thanks.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"One must be sane to think clearly, but one can think deeply and be quite insane."
As it sure is likely one of the causes of its death in the first place.
(Notice please that I say "one of)."
And, - now that it's dead, NOS is north of $600 on EBAY.
And, the SBT DOES have issues, - a noisy touch screen, crappy power supply, built in DAC.
And finally, one of the areas that the SBT really excels is the area of Internet radio/Internet enabled streaming apps, etc. The quality of all streaming services is shite.
Don't get me wrong, the SBT is a great box, I have 2 and enjoy them immensely: and I'm trying to buy a 3rd for the garage. But don't pretend that it's as good as an optimized PC, or one of the 4 other streamer transports that are coming out. For some folks, lower quality is outweighed by the crazy amounts of other features and "Swiss army knife" aspects of this great little device.
Cheers,
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
You said "And, the SBT DOES have issues, - a noisy touch screen, crappy power supply, built in DAC".
What do you mean by a "noisy touch screen"... I don't use it anyway, but curious what you're talking about.
Also buying a separate dedicated power supply is a Plus for the SBT. I am glad it is not built in and noisy. There are some quiet external ones out there for $150. I do take the wall wart power supply with me when traveling.
Agree that no DAC would be better, as I always use a separate DAC at home, but when I travel with my SBT, I do use the internal DAC and it saves me from having to bring one.
Cut-Throat
I was just trying to make the point that some of these other streamers that are competing with, and exceeding, the SQ of commercial computers, eschew displays and DAC, and have better PSUs.Essentially someone should not have the expectation that any sub $1000 device is going to be a "high end" device. - An equal to the Squeezebox in features should be $600+.
Any display is going to account for some noise: I haven't dug into the SBT to see if it can be shut off. But then, - I am not using the SBT in a context where I would likely be able to tell....
"Asylums with doors open wide,
Where people had paid to see inside,
For entertainment they watch his body twist
Behind his eyes he says, 'I still exist.'"
Edits: 08/20/14 08/20/14
You can shut off the display if you want....
See Soundchecks Squeezebox Touch Modifications to run the SBT in a more 'audiophile fashion'
Cut-Throat
can you please be more specific? Thanks...
I also use one from Welborne Labs. I like this one better as it has a switch on the front for power. Which is great for resetting the SBT.
Cut-Throat
I see you are using a SB Touch, the unit you linked to is a 1 amp
Their web site shows a 3Amp unit for the Touch...
Am I missing something?
Thanks
Here is the link that I should have given you. I have the ~3 amp version.
Cut-Throat
waiting for them to reply to my request to buy one..
thanks for the links and info
Spot on. The SBT is and was an exceptional product.
But for PURE sound quality, as surprisingly good as it was, it has been bettered by a host of stripped down devices. The usual names I have posted about..
a) no Wi-Fi - That's a good thing in my book and wouldn't affect my consideration. I tried using wi-fi when I originally set up my netbook based system and it was less than satisfactory.b) no display - Tablet/Phone/PC Apps available for free - Even though I use a netbook based system at the moment, the netbook lid is usually closed and I just use a phone app for selecting music.
c) roughly 5 times the price of SB Touch - Fair call, but I don't think the cost is outrageous, especially when compared with some of the other bespoke streamers which are basically off the shelf PC motherboard in a nice box. And GBP 700 is not outrageous for a streamer and AMP Combo.
d) did not bother to read more detail about functionality after a to c
Pros for Roomplayer
1. Current product - Don't have to buy NOS at inflated prices, or refurbed/second hand items.
2. Neat all in one system... Just add speakers (Especially the version with the amp)... Ideal for people starting out...
3. No Screen ... Just hide the box somewhere and use the Supplied Apps to control it.
4. Silent - I am currently looking for an alternative streaming solution because the netbook I have is by no means silent and the fan takes on a life of its own at times. However, this is probably unique to my circumstances and not a Pro when comparing to a SBT.
5. Ethernet over power Compatible - Handy if direct ethernet connections may not be available.
Cheers
Welly
He hoped and prayed that there wasn't an afterlife. Then he realized there was a contradiction involved here and merely hoped that there wasn't an afterlife.
- Douglas Adams
Edits: 08/19/14
I agree that it is a NO by a Huge Margin.The biggie for me is that it does not Stream Spotify as far as I can tell.
I use the SBT with an Ethernet Connection, but when I Travel, it is WiFi.
Also, the lack of a program for a PC (just mobile apps) is a NO Go for Me....
I don't think it has a remote like the SBT also? Correct?
I'll take a Used SBT on E-bay any day!
I would like to see an Audiophile Squeezebox hit the market someday and would be willing to pay a couple Large for the right device.....But this ain't it!
Cut-Throat
Edits: 08/19/14 08/19/14
I agree that it is a NO by a Huge Margin.
The biggie for me is that it does not Stream Spotify as far as I can tell.
Not an issue for me as I very rarely use spotify
I use the SBT with an Ethernet Connection, but when I Travel, it is WiFi. - Horses for Courses. In my situation, it is plugged into the home hifi full time, so ethernet is preferable, as it is more reliable in my situationAlso, the lack of an App for a PC is a NO Go for Me.... There is an App for PC and ipad/iphone... There is also an android version in beta according to their website.
I don't think it has a remote like the SBT also? Correct? Apps are used to control it as far as I can see, rather than a separate Remote.
I'll take a Used SBT on E-bay any day! I don't generally like buying second hand, so a new item like this is preferable for me. Also, I still think that the Roomplayer would be ideal for newcomers to audio and streaming due to there being an option of a combined streamer/amp. Also, the Roomplayer does 24/192 out of the box (Although, I believe that SBT can do this with addons).
Ideally, I'd like a unit similar to this but with additional digital inputs, so that I could also use it as a "hub" for all of my digital sources like my TV, Blu-Ray player and PVR.
I think a small, headless box like this with a phone/PC app, is the way I'd like to go, but maybe not this exact one. I quite like the idea of the Pioneer N-50 as well
Cheers
Welly
He hoped and prayed that there wasn't an afterlife. Then he realized there was a contradiction involved here and merely hoped that there wasn't an afterlife.
- Douglas Adams
Edits: 08/19/14
I'd go for this!
Cut-Throat
As mentioned previously, I'd prefer a headless unit that can be hidden away and use my phone/tablet to select music.
I have nothing particular against the Squeezebox, but the provision of a touch screen is not necessary or useful in my situation, because the streamer is not (would not be) located next to my listening seat. Therefore, a phone or tablet App makes more sense to me...
As I mentioned previously, I like the idea of the Pioneer N-50, but I have also considered the possibility of a Raspberry Pi (Or similar), with one of the piggyback DAC boards like the Wolfson one.
The Bluesound Node also appeals.
Cheers
Welly
He hoped and prayed that there wasn't an afterlife. Then he realized there was a contradiction involved here and merely hoped that there wasn't an afterlife.
- Douglas Adams
So, less features than the SBT and a whopping price tag of over $800!
Cut-Throat
Weird how it seems people are trumpeting the lack of features (e.g. optional wifi...you can turn it off, remote control by incl. remote, iGadget/Android/PC, USB DAC) as somehow raising the stature of a much more expensive device that does less...pretty hard to argue a comparative positive, unless price is irrelevant.
SBT wasn't *that* cheap in Canada when current, only sold by 1 or 2 places and was ~$275. Compare that to around the same time as as low as ~$150 at UK amazon. I still feel stupid for not buying more...to keep/use that is. You have to be mighty quick to even get a shot at a used one here, and you have to pay a good premium over new.
It is strange that Logitech wouldn't just start churning them out again to meet some demand, but I bet it's not so easy to get a giant Chinese factory to do that if you only want to make say 10k. I know they can do it, but it probably wouldn't meet Logitech's profit margin requirements at that production level. I have seen another Large Company do this exact thing with a remote control (IMO the best one ever made) due to huge demand after discontinuing, and they even improved it somewhat, and lowered the price! But all it takes is one necessary chip to not be available any more (not that unlikely in the SBT's case) and the whole design is screwed, and you can forget it then since it would become virtually a whole new product.
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