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In Reply to: RE: Your Knowledge Of Critical & Academic 20th Cent Trends posted by Newey on October 29, 2015 at 22:40:11
Yes, Serialism (though you realize there's more to modernism than Serialism?) was all the rage for awhile, but: are you saying that *no one* has ever challenged their alleged negative attitudes toward the Romantic era? Ever? Except you?What do you really know about these people? Psst: sometimes they've even challenged themselves! And, darn it, even before you got the chance to set them straight.
For example:
Did you know Milton Babbit loved cheesy musical theater? And even wrote a broadway show?
Did you know that Boulez listens to Tchaikovsky for...pleasure??? OMG!!!!
Stravinsky, who hailed Eliot Carter's "thorny" Piano Concerto a masterpiece and later wrote in the "modernist" style himself, said that there's still plenty of good music to be written in C Major, which brings me to my point:
"Modernists" don't hate the Romantic style, they simply hate poor, warmed-over, derivative re-hashings of said style.
Tell us: which Academic held a gun to Barber's or Rachmaninoff's head and forbade them to write?
Did you know that those evil "modernist academics" voted to give Samuel Barber the Pulitzer prize at the height of you so-called war? Twice! (For his "old school" piano concerto and opera, Vanessa.) These are things that a poseur simply can't know.
You've put together nothing but a patchwork knowledge to serve your own ego and conspiracy theories. Your posts are nothing but gross generalizations, betraying your extreme discomfort with the genre. Every time you venture beyond simple rote memorization/recall to synthesis, your posts devolve into pure sophistry.This typical combination of cluelessness, condescension and ego is precisely why you're such a laughing stock. History--and the people in it--are far more complex than you seem to care to know.
Edits: 10/30/15Follow Ups:
Here we go again. This is getting tiresome. I feel as tho I'm lecturing a mentally deficient child, going over the SAME STINKING POINTS, over and over and over and over again.
> > You said, "EXCEPT ME." (Your caps.) Really? Except you? < <
Yes, really. I fully aware of how ridiculous it sounds, and I've typed it out a bit tongue-in-cheek, but to anyone fluent in musicological studies [which you are NOT - demonstrably], no one's put forward my idea in the 45 years that I've been reading and studying this stuff. Frankly, I'm discouraged and disgusted that a world full of bright people hasn't produced someone who could have done so, but the reason lays in the nature of academic research and the politics involved. That, however, is another topic for another time.
> > ...are you saying that *no one* has ever challenged their alleged negative attitudes toward the Romantic era? Ever? Except you? < <
NOPE. I DIDN'T SAY THAT. Never said that. Re-read my posts. Either your trying to construct a straw man in order to knock down, or it's your mental deficiency and lack of reading comprehension showing again. Maybe you should seek medical help.
> > Did you know that Boulez listens to Tchaikovsky for...pleasure? < <
> > Did you know that those evil "modernist academics" voted to give Samuel Barber the Pulitzer prize at the height of you so-called war? Twice! < <
For the Nth time [jeez, you're dense] - I'M TALKING ABOUT MUSICOLOGISTS! ANALYSTS! NOT COMPOSERS.
Did that sentence sink in at all. Jiminy? Probably not. Probably just flew right over that dim skull of yours. Can you even discern the difference?
> > your posts devolve into pure sophistry. \ < <
Sophistry? Huh? Let's see. If it's something you don't understand, and on evidence of all of your posts that seems to include pretty much everthing, if it's something you can't grasp - it's sophistry. Hmmm. How do you feel about nuclear physics? "Sophistry"? Nevermind.
Do yourself a favor and get smarter, rather than raving and hollering in ignorance. Go read Prof. Julian Horton's article linked to my Sonata Deformation post. That may at least get you started in the right direction.
N. Thelman, SSI
> Did you know that Boulez listens to Tchaikovsky for...pleasure? <
> > For the Nth time [jeez, you're dense] - I'M TALKING ABOUT MUSICOLOGISTS! ANALYSTS! NOT COMPOSERS. < <
> > > Sigh. Boulez is a musicologist and an analyst, as well as a composer. < < <
> your posts devolve into pure sophistry. <
> > Sophistry? Huh?> >
> > > See Boulez comments above. < < <
Simply denying historical events doesn't mean that they didn't occur.
You're denying actual history. That you're unaware of it's not surprising. Most people don't know musicological history, and frankly, we're better off for it.
What's unfortunate is that rather than learning, you're NOT learning. You're doing he opposite. Not only are you yelling your brains out that the musicological history of which you're ignorant never occurred, but your using that to blast AD HOMINEM attacks on me.
It's sad how you turn EVERY SINGLE learning opportunity into an opportunity to fight instead. Not only that, but every time you've posted something -- IT'S WRONG!! What do we can people such as that? Hmm, let's see? Ignoramus comes to mind, but I'm sure that there're better terms.
DO THIS--> > GO TO MY DEFORMED SONATA THREAD
CLICK ON THE ATTACHED ARTICLE
READ IT
Assuming that you possess normal or better IQ, that should get you on the road to being musically informed. Maybe then you can stop yelling your head off like an ignoramus.
N. Thelman, SSI
Jiminy Daniels has descended into doing nothing but hurling insults at me.
There's no more constructive or instructive dialog taking place here.
I have no wish to entertain or encourage a truculent troll. Therefore, I shall no longer post or reply in this thread, and I urge the moderator to use the option to freeze this thread to future posts.
Thank you.
N. Thelman, SSI
Please, anyone in the Newian camp--his fellow connoisseurs, etc.-- don't help, thanks. He's be so insulted; I'm sure he couldn't live with himself.
Edits: 10/31/15
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