Planar Speaker Asylum

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Planar Speaker Asylum

RE: No screaming here.

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In Reply to: RE: No screaming here. posted by esande on January 19, 2011 at 16:40:04

Everyone is interpreting my post wrong. It is not about me. It is not about their business model. Would everyone please go and actually read what I wrote.

The slight I perceived was towards the tweaking community in general, of which I am only one person of very many. I was defending what we all have done, not what I may have done.

In one sentence he says they've tried everything, even things we never thought of, and the next minute he says they don't have time to examine every nuance and they don't care to try. Well which is it?

Well, whatever it was supposed to be I clearly didn't understand.

It's all about the music...

Follow Ups:

RE: No screaming here. - josh358 16:11:53 01/20/11 (0)
Yeah, he was unclear there. But I think he was saying that they've tried versions of pretty much every tweek, which I believe, based both on evidence and common sense. But they haven't tried the *specific* tweaks here. So if someone says Sonicaps, say, improve the crossover, they haven't evaluated that specific statement.
It's not about me - sorry, Charlie. - wazoo 05:13:20 01/20/11 (2)
You lost the right to speak for anything the rest of this community does when you repeatedly criticized such actions. According to you, yours is the only path to greatness. So, now you have the gaul to intimate that you are speaking for the entire community - a community to which you have been disrespectful.
"There are only 2 things any maggie needs done:
1 - a better XO
2 - a wooden frame"
By 'a better XO', you were speaking of yours and only yours. By wooden frames, you mean that they must be constructed as you built them.
"IMHO this dynamat topic has been adopted by people who can't or won't fix this problem the right way, and that is by making wooden frames. If you're making frames, do yourself a favor and forget the dynamat."
Well, someone suggests an alternative method of dealing with the vibrations you claim to be the whole problem and you can't accept the possibility that he might have a point - how respectful, eh?
"It's not rigidity. As I just said to someone above, as far as I can see everyone in the past "assumed" things and then did stuff to their speakers to fix them. If the slightest improvement followed they assumed the assumption was correct. It wasn't.
I was the first one (I think) to go outside that box and try to figure out what the problem actually was. In doing that, I did."
It's not rigidity - subtext, don't waste your money on Mye Stands. The rest is a nice example of your ego.
"Barry, I think it's time you went to the trouble to mod them properly."
As I said, everyone else in this community is just piddling around. Your mods are the only ones that are proper.
Should I continue? There are many, many more of these. You state over and over (ad nauseam) that your way is the way and that everything else is just a waste of time. We aren't idiots. We remember what you say. You can't claim that the offense you took from Wendell's comments were about anyone except you , or is this a matter of your being the only one permitted to insult others in this community? Isn't it curious that you are the only one to take Wendell's comments as an offense?
You really should consider a career in politics. You have the demeanor for it.

"Information is not knowledge.
Knowledge is not wisdom.
Wisdom is not truth.
Truth is not beauty.
Beauty is not love.
Love is not music.
Music is THE BEST." FZ

Edits: 01/20/11
- RE: It's not about me - sorry, Charlie. - IEaudiodude 06:57:34 01/20/11 (1)
  Thanks wazoo, VERY well said. I just read 11 posts from a person who doesn't let things bother him ,that's 11 when he isn't upset, can you imagine if he was upset ? of course you can, we read it all the time ! If I were Wendell there would be no way in hell I would come on here either .....Why would he want to listen to that every time he signed on ?
  - RE: It's not about me - sorry, Charlie. - Norman M 07:54:04 01/20/11 (0)
    He could sign on here, informing readers of a promise to pull his weight around Magnepan to address their QC issues. Instead we learn about "Galina"; why in hell his WD's personal life of importance to any reader? He could just as easily said that an *impartial* 55 year old female auditioned their speakers. As an aside, and in the Russian wife market, I have a 70 year old brother-in-law whose found much youger Russian women eager to emmigrate to the US in the hope of obtaining their green cards. Unfortunately, and if you're interested in such situations, most seem to come along with children. And by the way I side with PG in all of this. Please God, protect us.
RE: No screaming here. - morricab 03:45:13 01/20/11 (0)
"The slight I perceived was towards the tweaking community in general, of which I am only one person of very many. I was defending what we all have done, not what I may have done.
"

Apparently you were about the only one to "perceive" this slight. I read it and I didn't get that impression.
A message from "Peter Gunn" at Magnestand - Davey 21:22:54 01/19/11 (0)
"It's not about me."

I laughed out loud at that one. :) Thank you very much.

Dave.
I get it. - esande 20:56:09 01/19/11 (12)
It really comes down to two sentences:

"I don't recall a tweak that we haven't tried in some fashion."

Fair enough, and probably true. Magnepan has engineers, and they probably HAVE tried a boatload of changes over the past 40 years. Some of them made it into production and likely most of them didn't.

They still have to hit a price point.

"We don't expend any energy or time to confirm or deny the effectiveness of any idea."

A (possibly) badly constructed sentence. I think what he meant to say was that they don't arbitrarily evaluate third party ideas just because they come down the pike. I have a feeling that they KNOW that some of those ideas, maybe, almost certainly MOST of them, aren't going to be economically feasible from a production standpoint.

To my way of thinking that isn't a diss, it's just a realistic statement that they can't act as a free laboratory for anything that some civilian proposes.

That he says that we're having fun and he sees no reason to mess with that is GOOD. It's not a value judgement on what people are doing here.

Mr Diller KNOWS he can't duplicate anything close to full-monte Magnestands and still make money.

Probably they even have some, I would if I were in their place.

I'd have some Apogees around too, and they MUST have taken them apart at one time to determine the patent infringement.

And I'd have some Analysis Audios, etc. If I were making Fords I'd KNOW what Chevy and BMW and even Bugatti were doing.

But if the mission is to make and sell Magnepans at a price point, it might be nice to know that Analysis Audio and maybe even PG can do it in thus and such a way, it's just that that's not the way I've chosen to do it.

At least, that's the way I see this.

If it's any consolation I think your mods are great value for the money and truly take the Maggies a Hell of a lot closer to their potential than stock.
- Meaning of Second Sentence - HarlemAirShaft 22:58:25 01/20/11 (3)
  What he is saying is that Magnepan won't confirm or deny how they feel about all the tweaks they have tried.
  
  In other words, if you ask them how they feel about changes to crossovers or stands or orientation or WHATEVER, they will ignore you or simply say "no comment".
  
  He thinks they have tried - and therefore evaluated - EVERY tweak in the world. All the ones on boards like this one and tons of others we would probably never imagine. And they are unwilling to offer their opinion on these tweaks. Not that they haven't FORMED an opinion, just that they won't "confirm or deny the effectiveness of any idea". Sounds like they realize that "expending energy and time" on confirming or denying ain't gonna add to their coffers - SO WHY BOTHER?
  
  It sounds greatly like the source of the original posting is in dire need of an enema - because he is completely full of himself.
  
  Not a diss? One of my wife's friends happily told her she had regifted the birthday present my wife gave her last year. She may not have thought telling my wife in that way would upset her, but it surely did. And Mr. Diller may not have thought he was being condescending, but he surely was!
  - RE: Meaning of Second Sentence - josh358 06:49:24 01/21/11 (0)
    WHAT WENDELL DILLER WAS DOING WAS TELLING THE TRUTH and trying to do it gently and with good humor.
    
    Sorry for shouting, but I've worked in pro audio and video for many years, and I've also been a hobbyist, and if you think that the dabbling we do in a place like this is anything like what goes on in professional surroundings you're seriously naive.
    
    This is an AMATEUR activity. It bears much the same relationship to professional activity that a home movie does to an episode of Star Wars.
    
    Wendell Diller does NOT need us to tell him how he should design his speakers. We know LESS about planar design and Magnepan's market than he does. He's been doing this full time for years.
    
    And if his job is like any I've ever had, he doesn't have time to "confirm or deny" tweaks because he's trying to get new products out the door and yeah, he's concerned with the bottom line, because his job, and that of the people he works with, depends on it.
    
    Sorry, but I'm getting tired of seeing this guy crucified because he alluded, however gently, to what I would have thought was an obvious truth. The one piece of business advice I would ever give him would be to refrain from doing this in the future, because it's obvious that anything other than empty-headed phony PR flattery is going to be taken the wrong way by people who mistake their erector sets for a construction company.
  - RE: Meaning of Second Sentence - Green Lantern 00:54:13 01/21/11 (1)
    also I think -in a somewhat 'subtle' manner he's saying look; if 'Aunt Betsy' can't tell the difference between a $4 cross-over vs a $400 cross-over, then guess which one we're going to use to save ur ass money.
    
    "You don't have to be faster than the lion....
    just the guy running next to you.." -anonymous
    - A-HA! I KNEW Aunt Betsy was the problem! (nt) - Peter Gunn 06:15:39 01/21/11 (0)
      It's all about the music...
- agree and would add... - Green Lantern 00:23:20 01/20/11 (0)
  I remember reading wut, oh two-three years ago that Steve Winey (Jim's son and heir apparent) had: NOT 20.1's, NOT 3.6's, in his home but (as he put it) 'heavily modded 1.6's'.
  
  Not further info was provided.
  
  Talk about danglin' us on a chain..! lol
  
  Man-you gotta love this hobby!
  
  "You don't have to be faster than the lion....
  just the guy running next to you.." -anonymous
- I don't think anyone gets it. - Peter Gunn 22:03:48 01/19/11 (6)
  My post was not about me, everyone else is making it about me. He wrote a note to a board of "tweakers" and in it he dismissed tweaking. His point was....? I thought it was odd and a little rude, but to this board, not me.
  
  I admit it's probably not what he wanted to say or how he wanted to say it, but it still came across to me like that. Frankly, it didn't need to be said and he doesn't owe any of us an explanation.
  
  For the 30th time my post had nothing to do with what they do or don't do. I don't care. It also had nothing to do with me. I can't speak anymore without people automatically assuming I'm talking about me. I was not talking about me.
  
  Anyway, I'm the local whipping boy. I've had so many detractors like Davey make rude and unfounded attacks against me so long I couldn't care less. I don't even read them and they don't bother me, and I didn't take Wendells post personally either. I just think it would be nice if we and the parent company could find some common ground and his note seems to be saying there simply is none. I don't think either side really understands the other.
  
  It's all about the music...
  - RE: I don't think anyone gets it. - JLindborg 00:31:11 01/20/11 (5)
    I am at least 1 person that agrees 100% with You PG.
    I guess some people don't seem to actually read what You write or just don't have the insight.
    I construct and repair myself and I also found the message a bit... rude and condescending.
    Knowing quite a bit from my own and other planar designs I find the comment somewhat ignorant.
    But anyway... there are always "hard core" owners that probably shivered in aw by just reading the message.
    Cheers from Sweden!
    
    The one who succeeded was the one who didn't know it was impossible.
    
    Edits: 01/20/11
    - RE: I don't think anyone gets it. - Peter Gunn 07:21:46 01/20/11 (3)
      Thank God, a voice of sanity in the wilderness... :^ )
      
      However I have always felt Swedes were the most level headed people on the planet, so I'm not surprised.
      
      For the record, I think they read it but don't care. It's an excuse to get the poison pen out and attack me, and who among them can pass that opportunity up? They say it's about me... it's actually about them.
      
      You hang on too, we're past the half way point of winter. I know how much you guys love the summer. If it was 70 degrees here everyday and light till 11 PM I'd love it too. :^ )
      
      It's all about the music...
      - Agree and Disagree - Webnick 09:14:27 01/20/11 (2)
        
        In Reply to: RE: I don't think anyone gets it. posted by Peter Gunn on January 20, 2011 at 07:21:46
        
        As the several posts in this thread indicate, you are obviously not alone when it comes to the perceived slight to the modder/tweaker community in the OP. My first post on the subject was a diluted and perhaps a politically more correct assertion of same (PG, don't go into politics) :> ) However, sometimes you can be something of an ass when it comes to delivering your opinions/posts, which are usually valid, thoughtful, and helpful opinions/posts but that sometimes seem rather caustic (kind of like the opinions of Antonin Scalia - obviously, a very intelligent leader of the conservative Supremes - he can't seem to make a conservative point without personally trashing the liberals holding opposing viewpoints). And, of course, there is no doubting your contributions to the MUG and your talent in framing, etc. I think you have to accept that the ad hominem attacks against you come with 'the territory.' So you know what they say: no one likes a smart ass, but everyone wants a piece of it! You go, boy!
        Illegitimus non carborundum.
        
        RE: Agree and Disagree - Peter Gunn 11:54:44 01/20/11 (1)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Agree and Disagree posted by Webnick on January 20, 2011 at 09:14:27
        
        So now I'm the Antonin Scalia of the planar asylum? Well, there could be worse fates....
        
        I can be something of an ass huh? I'll have to try harder then and use my whole ass.
        
        What bothers me are the other asses who prompt my assininity (?) by attacking me with lies, warping my posts, saying things I didn't say or entirely mis-catagorizing it, and NOBODY ever takes them to task. They always get a free ride. (and it's remarkably the same people)
        
        Sorry, not on my watch. If being as ass is what's required to hold them accountable, then an ass it will be. I only now and ever have everyones best interests at heart, and all I said was I found his post a bit insulting. A few others agreed, yet ironically nobody is attacking them or calling them asses. And people rarely defend me because they know they'll be in the crosshairs next, and who would willingly want that?
        
        But I get LOTS of email support when this sort of thing happens, so I have a very good idea what the unshaven and unposting masses think.
        
        Anyway, this sort of thing needs to happen every so often to shake the dust up and keep the place interesting. If anyone thinks this affair is that dire they really need a new perspective. I very much doubt Wendell is going to cry himself to sleep tonight.
        
        It's all about the music...
        
        LOL! nt - Webnick 12:26:43 01/20/11 (0)
        
        In Reply to: RE: Agree and Disagree posted by Peter Gunn on January 20, 2011 at 11:54:44
        
        .
        Illegitimus non carborundum.
    - Is this a case of "Midgets unite"?? :-)) ... - andyr 01:10:59 01/20/11 (0)
      Are you also 1.2m high, JL? Do you have a mullet? :-))
      
      Regards from rainy Australia, :-))
      
      Andy

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