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I am shopping for a power amplifier, preferably tubes. My budget is limited to $3000, but less is always better ($1500 would be ideal). I have been listening to a lot of amplifiers, and then came across the Jolida 302B. There is something about this integrated that is MUSICAL. First, out of all the amplifiers I've heard in my price range, it gets this other dimention of pace and timing right...like an orchestra is really in synch with the conductor, but not computer like--like live music. It doesn't have the best microdynamics nor macrodynamics, but the medium dynamics are perfect. Somehow the overall whole is musical. So what is my problem? I'm an audiophile, and I cannot believe this INTEGRATED amp costs $995!!!. My current setup is a Cal Icon II cdp used as trasnport for the Audio Note DAC ONE.1x signature, into the Audio Research LS3 line stage into amps that I've been borrowing from dealers to audition to replace my old Adcom GFA-555II. Interconnects are audioquest emerald, and speaker cable is audioquest midnight internal biwire. Is the Jolida as good as it sounds or are my ears tricking me? I feel like I should buy the thing on principle, and use it as a "musical reference" while I continue to audition for higher resolution, microdynamics, etc. I also found I like the sound of the Spendor 3.1's. Similar to the B&W, but warmer and better bass. Any suggestions, comments would be helpful.
Follow Ups:
I am using an Audiomat Arpege and I do not believe I could happier. The Audiomat is an awesome amp. I have heard a lot of nice amps and owned a few, but nothing I have experienced quite satisfies like the Audiomat and I own the Arpege the least expensive amp they make. Also it seems every magazine review is glowing about their products, check out Listener and UHF. If you have an opportunity try to audition them. They also have great snergy with Spendor speakers.
Thanks for the suggestion. I live in the Washington D.C. area, and well, let's just say it is not exactly a hot spot for audiophile activity. But I do go to NYC once in awhile to visit a friend, and I'll look there. This has been a great learning experience.Thanks again for the rec.
I agree the Arpege is a very nice amp. It also retails at over twice the price of a new 302B, and not to mention, is very hard to find in the U.S.
Washington D.C. is not exactly an audiophile hot spot. So I doubt I'll get to hear the audiomat anytime soon. For $2200 there is a integrated from Italy: the Sythesis Shine. This amp is wonderful sounding. Has all the audiophile stuff I want, but it doen't have that musical FLOW that this Jolida have, which just really makes me mad! My wife noticed it immediately. Thus the Jolida made its way home, and now my wife is on the upgrade path for the front end! A $1k amp that turns your wife into a partner audiophile ready to drop $1600 on a DAC after the combo of the DAC and the Jolida made her jaw drop and her but wiggle? Now there is an amp I can't put a price on!
Jolida does make some very good sounding amps for the price. But whatever else you do, you should get that LS3 out of the mix. I had one for a brief period a long time ago. While initially it can sound very detailed and transparent, in the long run it is sterile and hard sounding. I can't imagine pairing it with an Adcom amp.But don't balk at the Jolida, you just may have found the amp that suits your needs for a lot less money than you think you should pay. Nothing wrong with that.
In politer terms, that is what the dealer told me. I think he said "you can do a lot better." And yes, 10 years ago I bought the LS3 and then bought the adcom because of budget and well, I just didn't know what to get, and figured I'd upgrade it someday soon. I went off to grad school and didn't listen to music much except on a nice headphone setup I put together, and when I got back to real life, the adcom, LS3 combo made my ears bleed!!! Luckily it broke, and I started down this journey.Your advise is much appreciated. The Jolida doesn't do everything I eventually want in an amp, but my ears are not bleeding and the cost less than $1k. I might just keep it for awhile. My wife loves the thing. She been sitting and listening to music with me for hours the past few days, and it has her on an upgrade bug for getting the front end right (thus the expensive audio note dac which made her jaw drop litterally!!!). A $1k integrated that can turn your wife into a partner audiophile for life? Can you put a price on that?!
Thanks,
You've just nailed what tubes do better than any SS I've ever heard, IMHO. 'S why I end up going back to tubes every time, in spite of the things that SS does better. Enjoy the music...what the hell do you care 'bout all that audiophile crapola? With tubes, I find myself enjoying the music, with SS I find myself listening to the SOUND...enuff said!
Well said. I tend to be a very analytical person by nature, and I LOVE live music, whether its a Mozart concerto or Rock concert, or some guy playing the guitar at Borders. One thing I've noticed at classical concerts that are really good is this: at first I get all excited at the sound of the bass, the velvety strings, the resonance of the piano...then I start to get sleepy...not because I'm bored...NO WAY, but because I'm so relaxed! I'm used to hearing SS gear that is hyper-detailed that make my ears bleed after an hour. This Jolida has the flow of music right, I get excited at first at the velvety strings etc., then I start to get sleepy. I see a connection here. Besides that, my wife loves this amp. It's turning her into an audiophile. She's been auditioning DAC's with me and the Audio Note DAC 1.1x literally made her jaw drop, and she said, "its not going back. It costs $700 more than the Jolida amp! A $1k amp that can make your wife understand your passion for stereo, and turn her into an audiophile of the correct type--one who cares about the experince of music in your home (plus the combo makes her but wiggle!). Now that's a product I can happily live with!
Spend something like $650. My Cambridge Audio A500 died a miserable
death. Anyway, needed to replace. Found an JD-302B. Got it with original tube installed. Works great with my 1C Vandersteens.Excellent Midrange. Cymbals aren't as sparklely as the real thing.
It did sufficiently replicated the disipation of a cymbal, but it
seem truncated. Not sure if that the speakers or the amp.But, I was impressed with the Bass. No slam, but, it was way richer in depth. A bass guitar sounds like a bass guitar. There was no muddy effects on the lower end.
There are options with Jolida's to include a separate output for a
Sub. You would give up an output, but, that would put the Bass
back in the SS area for a bit of slam.
Congrats. I agree. The highs are not audiophile fair, the bass isn't articulate, but it's not all over the place, and the amp simply does something right about timing. It's as if cd's are playing 10% faster. More expensive amps that get this or that right seem to slow the music down. I'm in love with this amp cause it flows.One lucky thing is my dealer makes his own amps (the prices of which are way outa my league, but they sound glorius)...he can mod the hell outa this thing if I want him to. He made a 300B triode version for a customer.
than the Jolida. At that price your idea of using it as a "musical" reference to keep the high-dollor amps honest is not a bad one at all. I should also mention in the year that I have hung around my freind's store I have never seen a Jolida come back for repair, nor have I seen a DOA out of the box. I have seen all the expensive equipment break at one time or another but not the Jolida. Maybe they are the Bryston of the tubed world?
I know I could do a lot worse. I had a lot worse for double the money! While there must be an amp/preamp or integrated out there that gets the musical flow right like the Jolida, while providing the audiophile stuff I want too, I haven't found it yet, and I'm getting sick of looking right now if you know what I mean. What's great is this amp has turned my wife into an audiophile! Based on this amp, SHE suggested we upgrade the front end intead of spending more on the amp. The Audio Note DAC 1.1x siganature (almost twice the price of the Jolida integrated) made its way home and her jaw dropped, and while I want to keep auditioning, she is saying that it is not leaving this house!!!. I have a feeling the Jolida is staying. I'm sure I'll upgrade in the future, but, yes, this amp will be the reference for musicality, and to keep me grounded.Thanks so much,
when your wife won't let the gear leave the house!I had the little Jolida (302?) here for a while next to my Spectron amp on the Newform Ribbons. The Levinson 390S was feeding it. In comparison to the main amp I could pick out the flaws, a little noise, lack of resolution and so on.
Yet at no time did the Jolida fail to satisfy musically. Anywhere in the house I happend to be while the Jolida was playing I would notice my foot tapping to the music.
I ended up buying a hybrid Jolida for my sister. In fact, heh-heh, a relative saw the little system I had put together for her (Dynaudio bookshelf speakers, and the tiny 8" velodyne sub with her sony cd carosel) and said that his was much bigger and better. Then she turned it on...she said he looked real confused and said "mine doesn't sound this good!". She said to wait ten minutes and it would sound even better. Heh, he quickly left. What a hoot!
I had a Jolida 202a in my rig before my current McCormack RLD-1/DNA-125 combo. Paired with my B&W Nautilus 805's, it was a nice little setup when I had it in a small listening room upstairs. That little amp always seemed to make the music FLOW... It wasn't very transparent and there seemed to be a warm sheen over the music but I sure enjoyed it.Then I moved everything downstairs to a larger listening room and it's weaknesses started to really show. It couldn't control the bass very well, and sitting father away from my tweeters made me feel as if I was missing lots of highs..
So I sold it. I still kick myself for that, as I think I only got like $375 for it. $375!! Damn I should have kept it upstairs.
Moving back to SS gave me the bass control and transparency I was craving... But after a year of this combo I am interested in tubes again. The McCormack gear doesn't have alot of the regular SS issues; everything is quite neutral top to bottom, and it is quite musical. But the midrange, I feel, is a little too honest. I don't sit back into my chair and cuddle up with the musician like I used to. I'm going to a Cary Rocket 88 to see if I can get that (colored but pleasing mids) back, along with the strengths of the McCormack...
Anyway, HTH. Jolida stuff, from my experience with the 202, is very very musical, fun to listen to, just not the last word in dynamics and transparency. Well-worth owning, tho.
That's a good way to put it..."the music flows." That's what I mean by the timing thing it seems to do. It doesn't have macro or micro dynamics, but that flow, like you said, lets you enjoy the music. I think it is worth owning and enjoying until I find that "almost-perfect" amp that has better microdynamics that make you emotionally tense and not quite so snuggly.Thanks,
I agree that it is well worth purchasing... But I don't microdynamics necessarily make one emotionally tense. Don't get me wrong--my McCormacks don't make me emotionally tense in any way. Almost all good high end equipment, once you get past a certain price, seems to be more relaxing.When I say I want more "cuddle" I mean I want a more tonally rich picture--maybe not as accurate as the McCormack, but more enjoyable. There is also that last bit of grain that I'd like to scrub out...
But as I said, the Jolida is well worth buying. It's musical, it's fun, and don't sell it later for $375! :)
I'm new to this forum and don't have all the lingo down. Two things my Audio Note DAC does is provide "color" to instruments (tonal richness?) and what I call microdynamics (the subtle vibrato of a violin, the slight bending of a guitar string, the subtle rubato af a good pianist, etc.) The Jolida seems to smear over some of these qualities, but it gets the timing right ("pace and rhythm"), and to me that is what makes it relaxing. Other amps I've tried so far that get the tonal richness, or better bass, or more micro and macro dynamics don't have that timing thing this Jolida has...the overall flow of the music. As I've defined it, (and I haven't done a good job!), microdynamics, for me, give me goosebumps. It seems to me that every audiophile is looking for certain things (we'd love to have it all!). I guess what this Jolida does, it does well, and as for the rest, it just doesn't try, and therefore doesn't get it wrong. I don't know. I wish every person who drops a lot of money on circuit city receivers would give this amp a listen.
"I wish every person who drops a lot of money on circuit city receivers would give this amp a listen."
I'm with ya there. Even a non-audiophile like a buddy of mine thought my old Jolida was a ball to listen to. Tubes would scare most people, tho."I guess what this Jolida does, it does well, and as for the rest, it just doesn't try, and therefore doesn't get it wrong. "
Yep, I agree there, too. I like that in a component. Honesty. Don't try to do what you can't, and do what you do as well as possible. :)Enjoy the Jolida. You'll miss the detail, I predict, but a fun foray into tubes for sure.
Do you think tubes would scare most people? My wife and I think they are romantic at night...turn the lights down, put on some latin jazz...its better than candles!I will miss the details, and I'm gonna keep shopping, but I'm thinking about keeping this thing so I can shop slowly and find that perfect friend of an amp. Right now I have no amp, and without an amp I have no music, and that is just not right!!! Besides, what an awesome "second system" you could build around this friendly unassuming integrated. If I keep it, every nonaudiophile friend that likes music is going to hear this thing, and if they like it, I can just tell them, get a decent dvd player and you are set for music and movies!
Thanks again,
Hopefully my wife will think so, too. It can take the place of a fireplace (we have no such beast in our new home). :)
Yep, it's romantic! And it got really cold the other night, and as a joke, I went up to it to warm my hands...and you know what? It warmed my hands. It is like a little fireplace...like when its' late and all flames are gone and there is only the romantic glow of the red hot cinders...If I keep it, I will heed your words: don't sell it!
I'm using a Jolida 502B with a Naim 3.5/Flatcap and Vienna Acoustic Bach loudspeakers. It's the best sounding system I've ever had, but nowhere near the most expensive.
I wish I new about the Jolida products sooner like you guys! How does the 502 compare to the 302. They have a lot of integrated amps! I feel like stopping my search for awhile and just snuggling up in my sweet spot for a long while and listening to music with the 302B!Thanks,
Jack
p.s. Lovely system you have. I've heard the "rythm and pacing" thing I'm talking about, that the Jolida has, associated with Naim gear more than any other. It must sound nice indeed.
In my opinion, I think the 502B is the better amp. It may lose out a little on midrange sweetness but I think it makes up for it with better bass extension. It sounds more powerfull than the 10wpc difference would sugest. I use mine with JJ KT88's. The real synergy is between the Jolida and the VA Bach loudspeakers. They sound like they were made for each other. I also have it hooked up to an old analog Realistic tuner that has been modified by Antenna Performance Specialties. Great tuner. Sounds fantastic, picks up everything on the dial. I had a Conrad-Johnson MF2500 [ss] amp and PV14L preamp before the Jolida. I kept the combo for about a month and a half. I can't put my finger on it but it just never sounded "right". I sold them, bought the Jolida, pocketed the extra cash and haven't looked back. My system sounds just about as good as any I've heard. [when everything is right :)]
Thanks for all the info! And I agree...the Jolida, though it doesn't do certain things, doesn't seem to get anything wrong like the higher priced equipment seems to (so far, in my auditioning). I think it knows its limitations, does what it does correctly, and doesn't try to do everything, so it doesn't get other stuff wrong. I tried the Jolida with Spendor speakers and I think it was a good match...they are warmer than my B&W's. I'm gonna give the 502 a listen based on your recommendation, and try to find out more about your speakers...I've never heard of them.Thanks again!
I have Jolida equipment and love it. If it sounds good to you why question it? Just because something is relatively inexpensive it doesn't mean that there is no value. It is almost asinine to question what you are hearing and somehow doubt it because of economics. I have jolida because it does what I want how I want and I consider it a bonus that I'm not giving someone $$$$$.
The reason I was questioning my ears was simply that I have only had the amp in my system for 3 days and thought it might be helpful to ask you guys about how it sounds in the long term. I'm glad to know you are enjoying your Jolida products, and I have a feeling I will be buying the 302B integrated this week, spending lots more money on cd's and forgetting about equipment for awhile. From reading other posts, that seems to be the ultimate strength of this amplifier. It is a pleasant surprise. Thank you very much for your post.
All I can tell you is that I'm very, very fond of my all-tube, integrated Jolida 801a, and feel no embarassment about it. I may upgrade someday, but I'm quite content living with this amp. I find it conveys the musical gesture in a very communicative way. I also find it very good at the frequency extremes, as well as having a very smooth and musical midrange.Of course Jolida won't be to everyone's taste, but I think it represents excellent sound and value.
eb
I really must have got the wrong message across. What I was saying is that I think I really found a special amplifier in the Jolida 302B. I was asking you guys about it because I have only had it in my system for 3 days, and was curious about long term satisfaction. I am probably going to buy this amp in the next few days, and I am in no way going to be embarrassed...to the contrary, I'm going to be really proud that I found this giant killer of an amplifier! So cheers to you and all those others out there who found Jolida way before me, and I'm going to be proud to join the club of Jolida owners who are listening to more music and less equipment!Thanks,
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