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Re: May I correct your arguments on your incorrect assumption.

OK, I misinterpreted your statements on a couple of points.

Re your response:

"But I defintely want my seat be 13th row centre for a symphony concert hall where I believe it gives me the best overall balance of the musical performance+hall acoustics."

Really? 13th row centre in every symphony concert hall, regardless of the fact that they all have differences in sizes, different proportions, and different acoustics?

I'd believe you if you said you like to listen in the far field where the reflected sound field makes a strong contribution to the overall mix.

I don't know where "13th row" is in your favourite hall. I prefer to sit around a third of the way back in the seating area of the hall for some halls and some music, but I do go for closer or for further away in some cases.

"Using live events as the yardstick is better than do it whatever way one prefers. Some good reference is far better than no reference. "

I agree, provided we're talking acoustic music performed without microphones in a hall with reasonable acoustics as the yardstick events. I have heard live performances that sounded abysmal and where I would prefer a live recording, had one been made at the eventt, to sound quite a deal different to the real thing. On the other hand not everyone will agree with that premise, either in the way you stated it or in my modified version of it, and those people who don't agree with it are quite justified in pursuing whatever sonic goal they prefer when listening to recordings. The purpose of listening to music is enjoyment and doing so in a way which brings you enjoyment actually makes sense. Why listen to music at home if the way it sounds does not give you joy? I'd rather see someone listening to and enjoying music at home on a system delivering sound that I regarded as unnatural and unnaceptable than see them not listening to the same music because they don't like the way it sounds on the sort of system and setup that you or I prefer. If you want to transfer the view I'm presenting here to literature, I'd rather see someone reading, even if they read pulp fiction I would never be seen dead reading and never read anything I regard as worthwhile, than see them not reading at all because their alternative to not reading was reading my reading choices and they have no interest in my choices.

Having said all that, I also regard live performance and recorded performances as different art forms. What works in one sometimes doesn't work in the other. One also listens very often to some recorded performances, something that is impossible with a live performance, and that changes how and what one listens to and for in the performance, especially as one becomes more familiar with a particular recording. I don't listen to recordings in the same way that I listen at a live performance. I also like to find new things in a recorded performance when I listen to it again and again. I don't want the same experience every time—that becomes boring and then I stop listening to and enjoying that recording. I feel I've "played it out". I personally find a lot of difference between listening to a live performance and listening to a recording and I find nothing wrong in having a system and listening setup at home that presents some things differently to the way I like things presented when I attend a live performance.

I'm prepared to bet that we don't listen to and for the same things in music, even when we're listening to the same music. With classical music I tend to prefer small group works rather than symphonic works these days, and I also like to be able to follow the contribution made by individual performers and/or individual intstruments. Those aspects are also important to me with jazz, which is my main interest these days, and similar preferences apply there. My preferred listening setup for recordings is a near field setup which gives a much closer perspective than I prefer in most live venues I've been in over recent years. That is a personal preference. Others may try to recapture as much of their live performance experience as possible when they listen to recordings. That's their preference. Nothing wrong with that, we don't all have to have the same preferences, but there's no reason to believe that our personal preferences represent the best solution for everyone.

I wholeheartedly agree that one should try to avoid unwanted reflections with the listening room setup but not all reflections are unwanted or avoidable. In the matter of open stands vs stands with a beard, the reflections introduced by the beard can have benefits with SOME speakers, and there are some speakers where the designer actually recommends such a stand, as is apparently the case with the VMPS speakers which prompted the question that started this thread. Restricting their radiation with a beard is apparently the way those speakers are intended to be heard. Some people may have a preference for a stand with a beard for some other speakers. The beard can provide some support at lower frequencies and some listeners may find that benefit outweighs any disadvantages introduced by the beard. The reason for that may be that they find their speakers slightly deficient in the lower frequencies (that may be a speaker problem or a room problem) or it may be a 'sonic taste' preference and they can't find or afford a speaker that gives them quite what they want and the stand with a beard is the best compromise in the situation.

Just because someone does something differently to the way you or I think it should be done doesn't mean that they're indulging a "personal preference as to how they would like to play with their toys". It could well be a considered decision that represents what they regard as the best compromise for them in the situation. To represent all deviations from one way of doing things, whatever the reasons supporting doing it that one way, as degrading the standard of result achievable tends to imply that the deviation stems from ignorance and that if the person making it knew and understood the principles involved in getting good sound they would do it differently. That most definitely is not the case. Many people can and do deviate from the way you or I do things in full knowledge of the principles involved, and they are making a conscious decision to pursue a different sonic goal than you or I. They're making a very informed decision. We may not agree with it, and we don't have to agree with it, but however we want to regard it we should not regard such choices as merely pointless and destructive games being played with toys.

David Aiken

PS: my wife was a pianist and we lived with a piano in the home for 27 years until I sold it after her death. I'm also familiar with the sound of a live piano though I don't hear that sound anywhere near as often these days as I used to. I started playing acoustic and classical guitar over 40 years ago and while I no longer play myself, I still listen to live music which is something I have enjoyed since before I started learning to play an instrument myself.

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