SET Asylum: REVIEW: Ming Da Ming-Da MC-805A Amplifier (Tube) by garyjac@myall.net

Model:	Ming-Da MC-805A
Category:	Amplifier (Tube)
Suggested Retail Price:	$1099 (pr)
Description:	Single Ended 805 Power Amps from China
Manufacturer URL:	Ming Da
Model Picture:	View

Review by garyjac@myall.net ( A ) on November 19, 2005 at 19:01:56
IP Address: 203.10.121.81

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Meixing (Ming Da) MC-805-A

Single-Ended Mono-Block Amplifier

Pre-Amble

Where am I coming from? I generally listen to stacked Quad Electrostatic loudspeakers in an 8 metre by 5-metre room with full tube trap and other acoustic treatments. I would also, generally speaking, be listening through a Push Pull power amplifier pair such as the Quad II-40 (40 WRMS) or Velleman K8010 (65 WRMS). Both excellent designs in their own right. The music, as we will see further into the review is varied from: Classical, Early, Solo Voice, Bossa Nova, Knopfler, Fogerty, Morrison, Lounge, Opera, and so forth. I can't abide modern industrial noises of the Rap and Hip Hop species. So there, you are now aware of my peculiar predjudices. I daresay you have some "weird" tastes yourself!

Introduction

A moment of vacant curiosity is all it takes. You're browsing the Internet (audio sites, what else?) and you come across "cheap" Chinese Hi-Fi. Moreover, you come across a relatively cheap SE amp, or amps. The risks are obvious - whom am I dealing with? Is the amplifier any good? Will I hate SE amps in any case? What sort of warranty is on offer - if any? Will my credit card details disappear into the great empyrean?

There are no doubt shysters out there who have second to third hand contact with the manufacturer and you just don't know who's who. Let's take a punt. A certain cavalier disregard for the essentials of one's finances may be necessary to get started in this sort of game, but once you're in, you're in boots and all.

Purchase and Delivery

I settled on "New York Sound Specialities" to buy from, mainly due to a complete lack of faith in another disorganised company called Ornec (Oxford, U.K.) who can't seem to keep several time zones in their collective heads from one day to the next - assuming it is, in fact, the next day, right! In any case, I go to www.nysound.com and look over the Meixing amps. Every model is "in stock" of course since there isn't any stock in NYC and the deal is done with a consignment agent in China to keep costs down. However, the ordering process is smooth, they take credit cards on a secure site, and after ordering on October 21, the amps, all 42kg (~93 lbs) of them are being lugged up the drive way on October 26 (in the same year) by a large tattooed gent working for a company that works for a company that works for DHL - it's complicated to deliver things to country Queensland, just take that as "read". Really, you can't ask for better than that. Total cost of $1,499 U.S. dollars, no Customs Duty since the lot was split in Singapore and came in under the $AU1000 limit - can my luck hold out, I ask myself?

I recommend www.nysound.com to you strongly, they offer a return to base warranty and it's free in the first 3 months if you use their carrier and free for parts and labour, but not shipping for the first year, if (again) you use their chosen freight company. As safe as you can be in the world of Chinese Hi-Fi if you're going it alone at this point in time I should say. NY Sound is fast, responsive, courteous and they seem to have good contacts in the People's Republic, and a direct buying account with the Meixing factory. All in all it was a good buying experience.

Packing

I know I'll get to the amplifier in a minute - OK? The amps arrive in triple-boxed splendour surrounded by firm poly-foam that allows no movement whatever. Even the transformers have solid blocks of foam inserted between them to prevent disastrous movement if dropped. The valves (tubes to you American chaps) are likewise individually cosseted in foam inside standard cartons wrapped in bubble wrap. The entire triple-carton affair is wrapped in 15 metres of bubble wrap (I measured, so there) and a waterproof layer (courtesy of DHL) to prevent any water ingress and yet another layer of protection. The cartons bear the label "This Side Up" which is, of course, routinely ignored by every handler on the planet.

Oh yes, the amplifiers arrive in perfect condition with the valve sockets numbered 1 and 2 for the smaller input valves so that anyone can plug the valves numbered 1 and 2 into those sockets. The 6L6GC and 805 triode hardly require ID. The 805 is the "very big valve" in case you're worried, so that only leaves the one, so it must be the 6L6GC. Blind Freddy could get this right.

Appearance

This is a nicely presented device of solid construction. The main deck and sides are made from satin brush (about No 4) stainless steel. It looks about 1/16th inch thick and more than adequately rigid for the task of supporting the transformers. This also acts as a heat sink to a couple of paralleled 5-Amp bridges in the case. The front and rear plates are 10mm (1/2 inch) thick aluminium with a black satin anodised finish and the corporate logo and model number suitably emblazoned in gold lettering. The valve sockets are externally dressed with circumferential collars of very shiny gold aluminium. The transformers are black boxes (what else?) finished in satin hammer-crackle, but a very fine stipple effect, not the usual dimples that we associate with hammer-crackle finishes. It does not look "industrial" if that's what concerns you. The transformers are surmounted with the company logo in gold. Around the rear the binding posts are substantial in size, well insulated and spaced apart to take heavy gauge wire and gold plated. Overall, not too much 'in your face', so the W.A.F. should be within bounds. They were well accepted here, but then, I'm sent "downstairs" to play with the hi-fi anyway and Home Theatre rules upstairs.

The 805 triode sits significantly 'erect' in front of the audio transformer (Jeez these valves are big - is THAT why I bought this amp?) and the 6L6GC driver directly in front of that with a 12AU7 to the left and a 12AX7 to the right as viewed from the front. All valves supplied are of Chinese manufacture - you guessed - and that's how I fully intended to listen to it - with stock parts. I don't think it's a fair thing to review a product after you alter significant parts and then claim the sound is soooo great. This kind of procedure tends to be more than a little solipsistic in my view as well.

Operation

Plugged the valves in? Let's plug the power cord in. This is a standard IEC plug with a 3-pin plug designed for the Australian mains pattern. I don't know if Meixing build this specifically depending on the country of destination. The units also ship with two mains adaptor plugs in case you don't have this particular plug pattern at your place. They adapt the "plug pattern" to the socket. They do NOT adapt the mains input voltage. The amps are clearly marked 220V AC on the rear sockets. A quick squint into the gubbins reveals that the internal mains transformer switch can be set to 115V or 230V. A further perusal of the circuit schema kindly provided by NY Sound reveals two 110V windings on the primary. I presume the internal switch connects these in series for 220V as required, even though the internal switch is marked 230V. Perhaps 230~240 Volts is pushing my luck? I decide to hook up to the mains through a Variac set on 220Volts, since I know the mains here is at 245 VAC in the morning and 240 VAC at night and anything else in between these limits the rest of the time. All set!! The button is pushed. There is a great glow from the 805 after a second or two (the glare is unbearable, I'm used to KT88s) and no smoke escapes the enclosures, nor is there an acrid burning odour filling the room. Whew! That's always a relief. I say this from experience with building PP amps and having the odd one catch fire on power up because a track (or two) had been shorted by link wires or some such similar solecism. Transformer noise is absent completely from one amp. The other has a minute mechanical hum if I crouch beside it and listen at a distance of a foot or so. Nothing to intrude on the music form the listening position 2.5 metres away. The ON lights are blue LEDs (aaaaarrgghhhh), they're Bright!

After about 2 hours I am not pleased with the vibrations I'm hearing from the mains transformers. I, perhaps incorrectly, begin to suspect the amps will behave better on 115V. Drag out a couple of 240/115 isolation transformers, plug in, turn on and yes, that's much quieter, thank you. I exaggerate a bit here, but I really feel these units are 'happier' on 115V from the mains. Looking at the schema and the step up on the mains transformer tells us the story. It's about 3.5:1 and a small jump at input starts to add up considerably by the time you're out of the end of the rectifier. So, small differences in mains will make a difference I think. The isolation/ step-down transformers I used are nothing special, just your $80 off-the-shelf from Jaycar Electronics - ahem, like Ratshack, but Australian, OK?

Listening

After all I have heard and read about SE amplifiers I clearly came to this listening process with prejudices. Other people's prejudices, reviewers mainly - who listens to reviewers? Hands up!!

Prejudice One - SE amps are light in the bass, particularly below 100Hz. OK, I'm not comparing apples with apples. In fact, I'm not comparing at all. I live by the Quad dictum that the original sound is the arbiter of High Fidelity, not someone else's amplifier/speaker design. I fully suspect that if I connected a 16-20 Watt 300B-based amp to the Quads there'd be little bass below 100Hz. If it were SE2A3s then sorry; I'm not your man, nice and delicate as 2A3s are, they're a bit too twee to drive Quad ESLs. You'll need a 106db/W/m horn-loaded device for your SE 2A3 amps. To drive the original Quad ESL (a high impeadance load), one needs current and lots of it. The stacked Quads only manage 2 ohms at the topmost end of their impeadance curve so the amp needs to be able to hold on to its breath there too; but then, most civilised valve amplifiers do, regardless of the topology. This is one thing I will not compromise on, and one prejudice I will not forego - I consider the Quad ESL the best all around speaker ever made, stacked pairs doubly so, and I don't care that they don't go below 40Hz since there's bugger all music that is below 40Hz anyway. Organ and synthesizer devotees will differ in opinion on this I'm sure.

This 805-based SE amp does deliver significant quantities of bass with authority and precision. That's it - really. Plucked double bass (not so low) sounds accurate, period - the real thing. Bowed double bass, likewise. Electric bass, around 90-110Hz at the bottom is in the same category. Lower still, one can clearly hear the zip and sizzle of synthesizers working 'low down' in the Gladiator sound track - impressive - and about as low as a Quad will go. I have recordings that I could now learn the bass part from. I didn't know I had those recordings before. That's nice. I'm sure it's "real bass" because the Quads are not enticed into producing any kind of resonant or sympathetic bass as is the case with any competent electrostatic. The tonal quality remains true and the placement of the instruments remains exact within the sound stage at all gain levels that I would dare to use. I don't operate over 100dB on orchestral peaks or flat out R&R because my ears set the limit of what is painful. This is a domestic hi-fi system, not a football stadium PA. It's loud, very, very loud and it plays with consummate ease on those crescendos. I am sure I've driven the MC805s into clipping several times and I just cannot hear it, but I would be hearing a Quad II-40 start to lose some grip at the levels I'm referring too and I'd be turning it down I'm sure. I'm turning it down anyway since I want the use of my ears for some decades to come. This impressive output points to a competent power supply. The 805 can also sink a lot of juice apparently! Those primordial triode fires in there really do cook! To deliver the performance I am hearing the output transformer has to cope with significant DC (~105mA is my ball park guess) and hold its impeadance down at low frequencies requiring a high primary inductance. This takes a very serious hunk of iron, but the Ming Da output transformer must be all of 9kg (20lbs) and is just such a beast. The bass cannot be downgraded to "very good". It is excellent on all types of music.

Prejudice Two - SE amps sound poor at high frequencies. Doesn't leave much for high fidelity reproduction if you go along this path, does it? It sounds perfectly fine to me and I (and several others) hear no loss at high frequencies, no tonal distortions, no weird contractions in the sound stage or befuddlement of massed voices in choirs when someone hits the crash cymbals and so forth. Harps are particular amplifier killers in this respect and harp music is known to have humbled the systems of more than one or two rich audio types I know. The MC-805A reproduces this type of music with aplomb and indecently intimate presence as appropriate. It does not, I hasten to add, cast a 'stadium' space on to chamber music! It does, though, produce exquisite micro-dynamics in proper perspective. I can, if I so choose, easily follow any instrument in a small group, however loud and actually hear the part being played. My other amplifiers are not so expressive in this context. This is not 'graininess' by any means, or the kind of over-blown analysis one expects (and receives!) from a transistor amplifier. No, merely a representation of what I would expect in real life sitting in front of a small group - I could listen to one artist if I wished to concentrate or listen to the integrated whole. Correct high fidelity reproduction as far as I can see.

The Sound

Amplifiers do not have a 'sound'. Well, good ones do not have a 'sound'. They just let through what is there for richer or poorer. This is a very musical amplifier and it isn't so bad on the test bench either measuring <1% THD, for what that's worth. Here's a brief list of our ('cause there's more than me) listening experiences with the Ming Da MC-805A:

Blue Moon Swamp John Fogerty. Excellent driving bass lines and delineation of rhythm throughout the disc. Drummer can be followed without being made 'prominent' by the amplifier (indicates no frequency spikes in the HF). Small children's voices on 'Blueboy' are precisely placed within the sound stage and as the source (child) moves the ear tracks it effortlessly. Sounds less like a studio effect and more like the 'real playground thing'. The male bass on 'A Hundred and Ten in the Shade' is a superb example of how well this amplifier handles male voice. Excellent delineation of what the singer is trying to achieve with the harmonics of his voice as opposed to just singing (and hence hearing) a note. Beautiful rendition of male choir - effortless integration of voices that nevertheless remain distinct, as though you were watching the choir live. This amplifier does allow the ear to make up for a fair amount of that which the eye is not able to see.

Gladiator - The Music from the Motion Picture Hans Zimmer and Lisa Gerrard. Glossing over the fact that Zimmer has nicked a lot of this from Holst's Planets and I don't mean just inspiration(!); the MC-805 produces the full orchestral climax beautifully, at no time sounding strained or as though it is running out of puff. The track "Might of Rome" is ideal for showing just what this amplifier can do. Massively deep drumming, zinging synths in the bowels of the mix and all kept clear with the choir in the background staying lucid and believable. "Slave to Rome" is another excellent test of the power delivery of the amplifier system - big band going full tilt but no confusion or contraction in the sonic scenery.

Hang On Little Tomato Pink Martini. Top rung 'lounge' I suppose you'd call this, but then, how do you explain the presence of 'Autrefois' with its rhythms clearly based in Rap (yes, I kiddeth not), and a bass end to match! Overall China Forbes (no, just a coincidence) sings the chanteuse line in French. Whether you "get" this music or not this album shows the superb results this amplifier can produce with the human voice. For another example of the ability of this amp to keep solo voice in the foreground separate from the choir in the background, have a listen to 'Una Notte a Napoli' on this disc - great! I would rave further about this recording but that would have naught to do with the amplifier. Move on...

The Peter Mallick Group with Norah Jones This is what it sounds like up close and personal in the studio with some excellent examples of electric bass playing the loooooow notes. Listening to the cymbal work at the intro to 'Strange Transmissions' will convince one of the delicacy and power of this amplifier, if nothing else. Not the most dynamic of recordings but very appealing in its immediacy.

Verdi - The Requiem Muti conducting with the Ambrosian chorus and London Philharmonia on the Decca label. It's an old Decca recording (1979) and I know it was mixed on a valve desk. You are there, about Row 4 Centre Kingsway Hall London - assuming there was anywhere to sit while this was recorded. My favourite reading of this particular piece and it's like hearing it for the first time - again.

Summary

An excellent amplifier by any measure - musical or technical and well worth the asking price, even lacking the usual retail 'backups'. This amplifier as listened to is without esoteric modifications to components, special silver foil capacitors or shark fin resistors. There are a couple of Solen capacitors in there on the input valves. The small signal resistors are all metal film. The input valve is just capacitor coupled - no expensive input choke or input transformer. The input valve itself is the 12AX7, not the 12AU7 as you may have assumed and I do find that odd, but it seems to work. Today's high end, valve hi-fi is about marginal improvements on the frontier of sound reproduction. In my experience unless you have good iron including the mains transformer it really doesn't matter how good (or bad) your capacitors are, or anything else. It is the resolving power of good iron and a power supply equal to the task that turns marginal things like the noise of carbon composite resistors (if any) audible and draws our attention to them. Poor iron equals a poor sound regardless of whatever else you may do and Good Iron equals good sound almost in spite of whatever else you do. In my humble (how did that word get in here?) opinion, fancy capacitors like Black Gates/ Cerafines and silver wire and gold plated sockets may all make a subjective marginal improvement to the sound, and, for the ake of a bun fight let's give all these items their due. However, it all adds up to tiny margins together not worth as much as the least audible reduction (or improvement) in the quality of the iron. I think the only way to really improve this amplifier would be to go to a higher load on the output valve, which means, you guessed it, a bigger and better output transformer. The OPT in there is already around 9kg (20lbs) and we do have to lift the thing!

Technically, Chinese hi-fi in the area of amplifiers is getting there; of this there can be no doubt. The marketing side of things is another issue, but of a number of purveyors out there, I still think NY Sound is your best bet right now. High priced SE amp purveyors in the West do have something to worry about and it is the same thing that automobile manufacturers had to worry about in the 70s - how to compete. Local support for a product certainly has a value and you certainly pay for it with some amp makers - perhaps this is the area that local makers need to consider in the mark ups. Sooner or later these amplifiers are coming to a store near you. Avoid the gaderene rush and buy yours now before somebody 'discovers' them.

Gary Jacobson

(c) November, 2005

Product Weakness: After Sales support is either patchy or non-existent as yet so you will be employing a qualified 3rd party if something goes amiss in the first 12 months. NY Sound does, however, offer a pretty good returns policy under waranty if you're in the U.S.
Product Strengths: These amps are low cost and highly "tweakable" while being technically competent and musically satisfying.

Associated Equipment for this Review:
Amplifier:	Ming-Da MC805A (pr)
Preamplifier (or None if Integrated):	World Audio Design PRE-II (modified)
Sources (CDP/Turntable):	Linn Sondek / Meridian 501 (20-bit)
Speakers:	Custom Stacked Quad ESL (86dB/W/m)
Cables/Interconnects:	Blue Jeans Cables
Music Used (Genre/Selections):	Classical, Country, Rock, ... anything
Room Size (LxWxH):	28 x 15 x 8
Room Comments/Treatments:	Extensive absorption - JR tube traps and panels
Time Period/Length of Audition:	20 hours on the tubes.
Type of Audition/Review:	Product Owner

Product Weakness:	After Sales support is either patchy or non-existent as yet so you will be employing a qualified 3rd party if something goes amiss in the first 12 months. NY Sound does, however, offer a pretty good returns policy under waranty if you're in the U.S.
Product Strengths:	These amps are low cost and highly "tweakable" while being technically competent and musically satisfying.